What Happened to Morrissey? Part 2 - read on

[Comtesse]

Re: What happened to Morrissey? Discuss

I completely understand where you're coming from as someone who credits the Smiths-era Morrissey with saving her depressed teenage life. But I think it really depends on where you're coming from and what you look for in the present-day Moz. If I look at the lyrics, I have to admit that they are nothing compared to what he used to write circa Meat Is Murder (but then again, he stole most of his lyrics back then from books and films so perhaps I should be thanking Shelagh Delaney and Elizabeth Smart for saving my life instead?).

However, as I've aged along with Mozzer, I don't look to songs to save my life anymore (I'm not sure if that's a sad thing or a good thing) - and I find that I enjoy modern Morrissey more for the melodies and the lovely singing voice than for the lyrical content. And the melodies - with a few exceptions - are still top-notch. And the voice? Well, it can't be touched.

And occasionally he can still pull off a lyric that makes me stop and think, "Wow - that's exactly how I feel" just like in the old days. From the new album there were a few of those moments: "Even now in the final hour of my life I'm falling in love again," "I've been shifting gears all of my life but I'm still the same underneath," "The future is ended by a long, long sleep," "Living longer than I had intended, something must have gone right". It's only natural that as he ages and confronts his own mortality that he should come up with revelations like this, rather than the adolescent angst of the old days.

So, yes, Morrissey has changed, but for those of us who have changed with him, he still has plenty to offer, when he tries.

 

[Worm]

Oh, also, about The Edge?

U2 started as a punk band called The Hype. Except for Larry, the drummer, none of them could play an instrument properly. Well into their career they claimed they couldn't read sheet music and still had only learned one or two chords.

Most of U2's songs are carefully constructed, studio-friendly soundscapes, not blaring cock-rock. Even the anthemic tracks like "Sunday Bloody Sunday" are mindblowingly crude, a country mile from the sort of "muso" guitar shit to which people are comparing The Edge's songs.

Brian Eno did some of the best of his career producing The Edge, and that's good enough for me. Hate U2 or Bono, but give the little bald guy a break. He'd be a bad fit for Morrissey because his style is different, that's all.

And if none of that convinces you, at least spare him your wrath on this account-- asked in 1987 who is favorite guitarists were, he mentioned Johnny Marr first.

 

[King Leer]

The early Smiths records are great, no doubt, but lyrically they're a summation and reworking of Morrissey's considerable literary, filmic and musical influences. That was an excellent thing that nobody had really done, but as the years went on, Morrissey himself became an icon, and his lyrics have become increasingly direct, but not simple, more like brilliant shorthand. From wordy Wilde to Hemingway, perhaps?



Worm, great Monty Clift avatar.

 

[Worm]

The early Smiths records are great, no doubt, but lyrically they're a summation and reworking of Morrissey's considerable literary, filmic and musical influences. That was an excellent thing that nobody had really done, but as the years went on, Morrissey himself became an icon, and his lyrics have become increasingly direct, but not simple, more like brilliant shorthand. From wordy Wilde to Hemingway, perhaps?


Worm, great Monty Clift avatar.

Excellent summary, I think you're right on there. An even easier way of examining his recent lyrics is simply to note the most obvious change in his point of view: he has gone from choosing cover stars to being a cover star.

And tut tut, that's not Monty Clift, it's Alain Delon! Though Monty would have been fantastic, too-- if only I could somehow put Joe Strummer's drunken drawl in the form of a JPEG! I'll wait until Google figures that one out.

 

[Pervomartovtsi]

Re: What happened to Morrissey? Discuss

you are simply buck of selfish fans ,Morrissey is still great and I hope he'll never lose it

 

[Queen Victoria]

Morrissey isn't even trying anymore.

 

[Sir Alec]

Morrissey isn't even trying anymore.

And you call yourself a fan

 

[Please]

Thank you! that's exactly what I'm trying to get at - they're lacklustre songwriting is below Morrissey's talents. Don't get me wrong Whyte and Boorer wrote some great songs including b-sides, I mean they're responsible for my favourite Morrissey album "Vauxhall and I" and I love them for that BUT as of late their songwriting isn't up to what it once was. I'm not criticizing Morrissey - I still love him, but Alain and Boz's melodies all seem to sound the same, like they're repeating the same tune. Morrissey needs new blood in his band - or old experienced but still vital blood in his band.

but that is the sort of music that morrissey likes? so what is the point in trying to get him to sing over the wank music that the like of the edge produce.

 

[dazzak]

Morrissey ate my crumpet and I don't like him anymore.

The word of the year is "Fundamental".

 

[Danny]

When Morrissey sings a ballad I want to hear him singing that ballad and the music should merely support his voice. I don't want to even notice the music much. What happens with Alain's work is he does this perfectly.
It's only after the 10th listen you start paying attention and realise how good yet subtle and tuneful the music actually is. It's very different to Marr's in your face style but it says a lot for Alain's lack of ego.

 

[Stanley]

Fantastic. Some debate on this forum for once instead of everyone kissing mozzer's arse and saying that everything he touches turns to gold! In response to the original posting, I disagree that YATQ was a poor album. I thought the whole comeback was superb and the album I thought was really good with some great singles on. What I agree with is that ROTT is total toilet. Rott just about sums it up. You Have Killed Me and Pigsty are great songs, Pigsty in particular could be the best thing Moz has done for a decade but the rest of it is just dire. Plodding, lacking in melody and just totally lacking any puch or dynamics. Lyrically it goes nowhere and we get the same old cliches rolled out. Moz by numbers. It promised a lot with Visconti producing but totally fell short of the mark. The worst album since Kill Uncle and that's coming from someone who likes Maladjusted and Southpaw. Getting back to Pigsty, it sounds new, fresh and slightly different to the Moz of old. If the whole album had sounded like that it could have been his best yet.
Lots of you will disagree and shoot me down in flames but I don't think I'm alone here. It pains me to admit it. I've caught 2 shows on this tour and neither have moved me.
Jesse Tobias is not the answer. Yes, playing live he is great but his songwriting is lacking. I'm a big fan of Alain and I think the best songs on the album are his. Why move Alain out of the picture. Jesse can't fill his shoes. A new songwriting partner perhaps?
Who knows? Maybe it's a slight blip. Moz produces the best albums when he's up against it. Maybe he should come on this forum for some ideas...!!

 

[++++++]

Re: What happened to Morrissey? Discuss

I'm the only Moz fan I know who likes Roy's Keen!

I love that song too. Don't feel bad.

As for the topic at hand... there's nothing worse than some obsequious blowhard with his head shoved so far up Morrissey's ass that there's no telling where he/she ends and Moz begins. People are entitled to their opinions, and Moz isn't King Midas, no matter how much some people want to believe that. And this is coming from a poor fool who loves Maladjusted almost as much as Vauxhall & I (but neither as much as Your Arsenal and Viva Hate, just so people don't question my sanity). People wouldn't offer so many dissenting opinions about Morrissey's direction if they didn't care deeply about the man and the music. Some see it as selfish and are quick to label people who do it untrue fans, but I just can't bring myself to believe that there are people who have followed his career 100% unquestioningly. Methinks there's some people in this thread who are being dishonest with themselves.

There's nothing wrong with having an independent thought; it's fun.

 

[lukehart]

Well aren't Moz fans a bunch of jerks. First of all I have more indie records in my 2,884 record collection than all you pricks. I chose The Edge and Coldplay because patronizingly I thought you'd know them but not a guitarist for some early 90's UK indie band that sold a combined 10,000 records. You know I like The Edge's guitar playing and if you technophobic 50's revivalist c***s don't like a bit of "experimenting" (ooh dirty word for all you 30+ fat f***s ) then piss off. And quite frankly Coldplay are a great band - oh but because they're mainstream they're shit? Bitter that The Smiths never sold 30 million albums are we? You know Morrissey is a beloved social outsider, how ironic that most of his fans are bullying assholes who make people want to be social outsiders. So while all of you get old and fat listening to Morrissey become a pale imitation of Vegas Elvis - I'll be listening to new young bands with - oh no! keyboards! ( and even worse memorable songs ).

 

[Sir Alec]

Well aren't Moz fans a bunch of jerks. First of all I have more indie records in my 2,884 record collection than all you pricks. I chose The Edge and Coldplay because patronizingly I thought you'd know them but not a guitarist for some early 90's UK indie band that sold a combined 10,000 records. You know I like The Edge's guitar playing and if you technophobic 50's revivalist c***s don't like a bit of "experimenting" (ooh dirty word for all you 30+ fat f***s ) then piss off. And quite frankly Coldplay are a great band - oh but because they're mainstream they're shit? Bitter that The Smiths never sold 30 million albums are we? You know Morrissey is a beloved social outsider, how ironic that most of his fans are bullying assholes who make people want to be social outsiders. So while all of you get old and fat listening to Morrissey become a pale imitation of Vegas Elvis - I'll be listening to new young bands with - oh no! keyboards! ( and even worse memorable songs ).

I would stop judging people you know nothing about. You are the worst fan on the planet.

 

[Danny]

Well aren't Moz fans a bunch of jerks. First of all I have more indie records in my 2,884 record collection than all you pricks. I chose The Edge and Coldplay because patronizingly I thought you'd know them but not a guitarist for some early 90's UK indie band that sold a combined 10,000 records. You know I like The Edge's guitar playing and if you technophobic 50's revivalist c***s don't like a bit of "experimenting" (ooh dirty word for all you 30+ fat f***s ) then piss off. And quite frankly Coldplay are a great band - oh but because they're mainstream they're shit? Bitter that The Smiths never sold 30 million albums are we? You know Morrissey is a beloved social outsider, how ironic that most of his fans are bullying assholes who make people want to be social outsiders. So while all of you get old and fat listening to Morrissey become a pale imitation of Vegas Elvis - I'll be listening to new young bands with - oh no! keyboards! ( and even worse memorable songs ).

So basically, you're a Coldplay fan who signed up here to start a thread to slag off Morrissey and praise Coldplay in contrast.

How sad. Don't Coldplay have a forum?

 

[dazzak]

So basically, you're a Coldplay fan who signed up here to start a thread to slag off Morrissey and praise Coldplay in contrast.

How sad. Don't Coldplay have a forum?

I f***ing dread to think what that's like.

 

[~El Boydelz~]

So you have 2000+ albums and you think the best guitarists for Mozzer would be an old dinosaur who hasn't changed his style in 20+ years and an immitator or at least someone inspired by that same dinosaur. If an indie band who sold 10,000 albums is such shit, why do you then turn around and boast that you're so hip and on the ball buying new stuff (which I notice you don't name at all.) And based on your sales equals quality hypothsis perhaps Moz should work with Celine Dion's guitarist and perhaps Mutt Lange could produce. You are looking like an idiot right about now.

 

[ANGELES!]

Oh, also, about The Edge?

U2 started as a punk band called The Hype. Except for Larry, the drummer, none of them could play an instrument properly. Well into their career they claimed they couldn't read sheet music and still had only learned one or two chords.

Most of U2's songs are carefully constructed, studio-friendly soundscapes, not blaring cock-rock. Even the anthemic tracks like "Sunday Bloody Sunday" are mindblowingly crude, a country mile from the sort of "muso" guitar shit to which people are comparing The Edge's songs.

Brian Eno did some of the best of his career producing The Edge, and that's good enough for me. Hate U2 or Bono, but give the little bald guy a break. He'd be a bad fit for Morrissey because his style is different, that's all.

And if none of that convinces you, at least spare him your wrath on this account-- asked in 1987 who is favorite guitarists were, he mentioned Johnny Marr first.

God, your American romantasism regarding english (and now Irish) music makes me feel ill sometimes worm. Elaborate on how cock rock differs from rock anthems. Your comments on urban music in a past topic were more embarrasing I must say, f*** me you have an ideal of music that is just wrong, you read too much about music from England and it has grown in your mind and been overblown and has now created some sort of imaginary romantic working class ideal of northern Britain that exists in your own mind propagated by crappy Rolling Stone type media that you no doubt read.

Talking about music is like dancing around architecture, and you do it in the most ridiculous way.

 

[Queen Victoria]

And you call yourself a fan

I'm probably a bigger fan than you, dude.

 

[Trill]

Well aren't Moz fans a bunch of jerks. First of all I have more indie records in my 2,884 record collection than all you pricks. I chose The Edge and Coldplay because patronizingly I thought you'd know them but not a guitarist for some early 90's UK indie band that sold a combined 10,000 records. You know I like The Edge's guitar playing and if you technophobic 50's revivalist c***s don't like a bit of "experimenting" (ooh dirty word for all you 30+ fat f***s ) then piss off. And quite frankly Coldplay are a great band - oh but because they're mainstream they're shit? Bitter that The Smiths never sold 30 million albums are we? You know Morrissey is a beloved social outsider, how ironic that most of his fans are bullying assholes who make people want to be social outsiders. So while all of you get old and fat listening to Morrissey become a pale imitation of Vegas Elvis - I'll be listening to new young bands with - oh no! keyboards! ( and even worse memorable songs ).

You sound awful.