Years Of Refusal is a classic

this thread made me throw on yor. birthday is so epic!
 
this thread made me throw on yor. birthday is so epic!

It's unfortunate that we only have one live recording of it, with a strained vocal, no less :(

Lads -- change the key so Mozzer can sing it more comfortably!! You did it with SISMS and even released the 'official' VIDEO for it in it's live, transposed-down form. We need to hear this live again and with Moz feeling better!!
 
It's unfortunate that we only have one live recording of it, with a strained vocal, no less :(

Lads -- change the key so Mozzer can sing it more comfortably!! You did it with SISMS and even released the 'official' VIDEO for it in it's live, transposed-down form. We need to hear this live again and with Moz feeling better!!

yeah, it'd be nice if he adds it to the set. i'd love to see it live.
 
I'm not sure what I think about this actually. At the time it came out I listened to it non-stop (last.fm informs me it's my most listened to album this year). But recently I haven't had the urge to listen to it. I think the songs are excellent in general, but it lacks something of an atmosphere holding it together as an album, which even Kill Uncle and Ringleader (the worst albums) undeniably have. However, I think this might be largely my problem, this being the first album that has come out after I've been following Morrissey on tour, so that I was familiar with much of the material. Also, on the negative side (and this won't be popular), but I have a real problem with Carol... it's bloody annoying.

Criticism aside though, songs like Birthday and Mama, are almost certainly better than anything he has recorded since Vauxhall, and I would definitely not say that he has 'lost it' in terms of attitude, effort or lyrical brilliance. In the context of popular music, I consider Morrissey's entire catalogue to be 'classic', but within his own work, it's harder to say. Look how long it takes me to reach no conclusion!
 
I'm not sure what I think about this actually. At the time it came out I listened to it non-stop (last.fm informs me it's my most listened to album this year). But recently I haven't had the urge to listen to it. I think the songs are excellent in general, but it lacks something of an atmosphere holding it together as an album, which even Kill Uncle and Ringleader (the worst albums) undeniably have. However, I think this might be largely my problem, this being the first album that has come out after I've been following Morrissey on tour, so that I was familiar with much of the material. Also, on the negative side (and this won't be popular), but I have a real problem with Carol... it's bloody annoying.

Criticism aside though, songs like Birthday and Mama, are almost certainly better than anything he has recorded since Vauxhall, and I would definitely not say that he has 'lost it' in terms of attitude, effort or lyrical brilliance. In the context of popular music, I consider Morrissey's entire catalogue to be 'classic', but within his own work, it's harder to say. Look how long it takes me to reach no conclusion!

Why is it you can refer to ROTT as his worst album (a ridiculously inane notion) and still be a member of the Morrissey fan club? I write that YOR is an average at best, embarrassing at worst effort, and I get my fan boy card pulled.

I get it: you have to blindly support whatever Morrissey is releasing now and then one can arbitrarily criticize his past work. Real great standard here people...


wtf?:crazy:
 
I prefer Maladjusted to Vauxhall; Your Arsenal to Viva Hate; Ringleader to Quarry; Southpaw to Kill Uncle; and Swords to Years of Refusal. So I win.

Vauxhall is inexplicably bland by Morrissey's standards. Only Kill Uncle is a lesser recording (including compilations), not just in my opinion, but in actual fact.

Years of Refusal is class chic.
 
I prefer Maladjusted to Vauxhall; Your Arsenal to Viva Hate; Ringleader to Quarry; Southpaw to Kill Uncle; and Swords to Years of Refusal. So I win.

Vauxhall is inexplicably bland by Morrissey's standards. Only Kill Uncle is a lesser recording (including compilations), not just in my opinion, but in actual fact.

Years of Refusal is class chic.

Thanks for proving my point. Like I just wrote, you have to blindly support whatever Morrissey is releasing now and then one can arbitrarily criticize his past work. This being the mind numbing short term memory of the Moz-Solo forum, of course "Swords" will be "the greatest" Morrissey album ever...:thumb:

Whenever I want a shortcut to actually thinking about something Morrissey related, I just come to the forum.:)
 
Come on, Vauxhall95. Plenty of people on here don't like Years. Some of us do, quite a lot. And we've provided reasons why. Nothing blind about that. One would think that blindly supporting an artist would mean loving everything they have produced; disliking ROTT is by definition the opposite of blindness. Implying we are blind for liking a record is quite offensive.
 
Come on, Vauxhall95. Plenty of people on here don't like Years. Some of us do, quite a lot. And we've provided reasons why. Nothing blind about that. One would think that blindly supporting an artist would mean loving everything they have produced; disliking ROTT is by definition the opposite of blindness. Implying we are blind for liking a record is quite offensive.

No, because ROTT is actually a far superior record to YOR: better lyrically, with greater musical variety, and sheer bloody adventurousness. YOR is a timid piece of pop schlock which got what it deserved: poor sales and a disenchantment of many a dedicated Morrissey fan. Just because I'm the only dumb bastard to constantly point out that fact shouldn't detract from the reality that many a long time forum member departed after YOR. It was that bad. For those of us who love Morrissey for his words, YOR was a betrayal. For the rest of you, I honestly don't understand: do you listen to Morrissey album's for the music? Why not listen to a Buckethead album for the lyrics? It's just asinine.
 
Are you that narrowminded? Is a different opinion that incredible to you? The gradation between ROTT and Years is not nearly so great that it's impossible to prefer one to the other; I have the openness of mind to appreciate that some like ROTT more. But to suggest it's "asinine" to prefer one is ludicrous. Interpretation of art is largely subjective. Take a class in aesthetics. Now, if we were talking about the difference between Mozart and Britney Spears, you'd have a point, but we're talking about two similar records by a single artist, so you don't have a point. Now, for the record, I do love Morrissey for his lyricism. I like the lyrics on Years, and I've said why before (I recall you thanking me for my explication). I greatly prefer the lyrics and the music of Years to ROTT.
 
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And where is this precipitous fall in Morrissey's output you're talking about? The record received better critical reviews than ROTT, and seems to have gotten a better reception on this website than ROTT.
 
No, because ROTT is actually a far superior record to YOR:

Your opinion.

YOR is a timid piece of pop schlock which got what it deserved: poor sales and a disenchantment of many a dedicated Morrissey fan.

You seem to have forgotten reviews hailing it as his best work of the decade. And for your second point -- see the 'YOR is a classic' thread. I don't think Morrissey is running too short of dedicated fans after YOR.

Just because I'm the only dumb bastard to constantly point out that fact shouldn't detract from the reality that many a long time forum member departed after YOR.

It makes one wonder why someone with tenure (that's important, being a 'true fan' :o) like you hasn't packed his bags and uprooted :rolleyes: :D

It was that bad.

Your opinion.

For those of us who love Morrissey for his words, YOR was a betrayal.

So because I like YOR I don't like Morrissey's words? That's not arbitrary and biased. :rolleyes:

For the rest of you, I honestly don't understand: do you listen to Morrissey album's for the music? Why not listen to a Buckethead album for the lyrics? It's just asinine.

Your opinion. Noticing a trend here? I might suggest stop bashing other people's opinions and proclaiming yours as the end-all. Because it's really not. I and many others like YOR because of the lyrics. Just because you don't doesn't make you 'right', no matter how much you'd like to be.
 

Yes, my opinion. I have one, it differs from yours. I believe YOR is easily Morrissey's worst lyrical outing. Can you handle that? I am still allowed an opinion, or again: do I have to give a ringing endorsement to all of Morrissey's new material and then wantonly criticize older material like so many? Why do you take such offense to the fact I do not like YOR's when others disparage ROTT? Would you explain that to me defender of the realm.

P.S. Is it possible for you to actually write a post? It's so gutless to pick one liners out and critique them.
 
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Yes, my opinion. I have one, it differs from yours. I believe YOR is easily Morrissey's worst lyrical outing. Can you handle that? I am still allowed an opinion, or again: do I have to give a ringing endorsement to all of Morrissey's new material and then wantonly criticize older material like so many? Why do you take such offense to the fact I do not like YOR's when others disparage ROTT? Would you explain that to me defender of the realm.

P.S. Is it possible for you to actually write a post? It's so gutless to pick one liners out and critique them.

There's a difference between having an opinion and claiming your opinion is indisputable fact -- I'd suggest against the latter, as it makes you come off as closed-minded. Much like saying that everyone who does not agree with you is a 'mindless drone', 'tool', hasn't had enough tenure as a Morrissey/Smiths fan, etc.

P.S. Again, if you'll read my post, I utilized EVERY part of your quote in my response to you. Analyzing each piece seems more concise than oh, say, generalizing that everyone who disagrees with you is a 'tool'.. :rolleyes:
 
Are you that narrowminded? Is a different opinion that incredible to you? The gradation between ROTT and Years is not nearly so great that it's impossible to prefer one to the other; I have the openness of mind to appreciate that some like ROTT more. But to suggest it's "asinine" to prefer one is ludicrous. Interpretation of art is largely subjective. Take a class in aesthetics. Now, if we were talking about the difference between Mozart and Britney Spears, you'd have a point, but we're talking about two similar records by a single artist, so you don't have a point. Now, for the record, I do love Morrissey for his lyricism. I like the lyrics on Years, and I've said why before (I recall you thanking me for my explication). I greatly prefer the lyrics and the music of Years to ROTT.

I just disagree. I cannot see how a fan brought up on lyrical substance can stand by and say the two albums are in anyway comparable. They really are the difference between Mozart and Britney Spears. One is imaginative and substantive, the other is sugarcane. YOR is a good pop album; again if I wanted a pop album I'd look to the Top 40 as I'm sure there are loads of artists who deliver better pop music. Is this what you are all beaming about: that Morrissey has become just another pop artist? What a triumph for you all.
 
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There's a difference between having an opinion and claiming your opinion is indisputable fact -- I'd suggest against the latter, as it makes you come off as closed-minded. Much like saying that everyone who does not agree with you is a 'mindless drone', 'tool', hasn't had enough tenure as a Morrissey/Smiths fan, etc.

P.S. Again, if you'll read my post, I utilized EVERY part of your quote in my response to you. Analyzing each piece seems more concise than oh, say, generalizing that everyone who disagrees with you is a 'tool'.. :rolleyes:

I said anyone who thinks "Swords" is anything more than a cash grab is a tool. That's fact. One can EASILY find/buy/download all the tracks already. We waited six months for yet another re-issue re-package? My wanting it to be something more: to have Morrissey place a modicum of effort into the album seems to have sent you into a tizzy fit. This album could have been so much more. He could have emptied the vaults and given his fans something worth cherishing. Instead it's recycled b-sides, but I'm a bad fan for asking Morrissey to actually work for my money. Whatever.
 
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