Songs About Marr

Morrissey admitted that 'atleast' one song from Strange Ways was about Johnny Marr. but he didnt mention which one. so my only guess is "I won't share' you" I can't think of any other track that would be about Marr. anyone?

I can't see any lyrics that are directly about Marr, but obliquely...

"A Rush And A Push" could be about Marr.

It would be a TREMENDOUS stretch, but I can sort of see "Stop Me". The lyrics would have to contain lines that only Johnny could make sense of, little in-jokes.

But "A Rush And A Push" is the likely candidate in my opinion.
 
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People have this impression that songs about Marr should be all lovely dovey and flattering.

But what if Morrissey is a bit more cutting when writing about Marr? Has no one ever considered Stop Me is about Marr? A song about a man who goes out drinking every night and then lies to his girlfriend/wife about it.

My reasoning is Marr has been very open about his heavy drinking at the time. He later admitted that one of the reasons he left the Smiths was because it and his behaviour was putting his marriage in danger.

According to people close to the band at the time Morrissey spent a fair amount of time with Marr's wife who worked as an unofficial assistant to the band. What if Stop Me is Morrissey telling Marr to sort himself out and be nicer to his wife?

edit: sorry Worm just seen you have considered it. You're the first person I've ever known to.
 
woah *seriously not going there this time*
 
I don't believe "I Won't Share You" is about Marr. I read nothing in the lyrics that indicate that at all. That story just seems to have come out of people just looking at the title and wanting to paint Morrissey as some kind of obsessive monster when it comes to Marr.
I agree. It happens to be the last song on the last Smiths album so it seems to be brimming with subtext. It's not. Because "Strangeways" was the last album several songs were interpreted rather strangely, like the line "It's crap, I know" on "Death At One's Elbow", which was interpreted by a critic whose name escapes me as Morrissey's candid admission that his lyrics weren't up to snuff and hence The Smiths had run their course.

However, a "final message" case could be made for "I Keep Mine Hidden", which was the last Smiths song. I think Morrissey was probably directing those lyrics at Johnny.
I agree with both of you about "I Won't Share You". I also find it amusing that one of the songs where Morrissey most directly specified gender ('she') is the one people insist on being about Marr. You don't hear people insisting that "He Knows I'd Love To See Him" is about Linder, do you?

You are probably right about "I Keep Mine Hidden", but Morrissey probably didn't intend it as a last message. Right until the end, he didn't seem to think The Smiths were breaking up.

I would add "Hand In Glove". I usually think "Break Up The Family", too, but sometimes I'm not so sure about that one-- maybe it's directed at several people in his past.
Morrissey said it was about the group of friends he had in his early teens.

"The song 'Break Up The Family' is strongly linked with 'Suedehead' and 'Maudlin Street', that whole period in 1972, when I was 12, 13. 'Break Up' is about a string of friends I had who were very intense people and at that age, when your friends talk about the slim separation between life and death - and you set that against the fact that this period of your youth is supposed to be the most playful and reckless - well, if you utilised that period in a very intense way, well, that feeling never really leaves you."
Did you all consider the family a bad idea?
"No, we didn't feel that at all. The family in the song is the circle of friends, where it almost seemed, because we were so identical, that for anybody to make any progress in life, we'd have to split up. Because there was no strength in our unity. And that's what happened, we did all go our separate ways, and quite naturally came to no good. I saw one of them quite recently, and it was a very headscratching experience."
Because he'd turned into the complete opposite of what you all had been?
"No, not at all. Which is the confusion."
And your gang, were you outcasts, victimised by "The Ordinary Boys"?
"Yes, but half of it, I have to confess, was the effect of deliberate choosing. We chose to reject the normality of life, and be intense and individual."
http://motorcycleaupairboy.com/interviews/1988/songs.htm


I think it was "Angel, Angel" although I'm not sure-- and anyway I think someone said "Is this about Johnny?" and he didn't deny it, or gave a vague yes or something. As you said he's not that forthcoming.
Actually, he outright said it was about Marr. I'm not sure which interview this quote was originally taken from, it appears in a Mojo article:

Morrissey: Angel, Angel, Down We Go Together was written with Johnny Marr in mind and it is the only song that I have written with him in mind, post Smiths. I saw him in the music industry being used and being manipulated and I felt I was in a similar situation.
 
Morrissey: Angel, Angel, Down We Go Together was written with Johnny Marr in mind and it is the only song that I have written with him in mind, post Smiths. I saw him in the music industry being used and being manipulated and I felt I was in a similar situation.

oh get the f*** real, moz!
johnny being used and manipulated? HAH alrighty then....
 
People have this impression that songs about Marr should be all lovely dovey and flattering.

But what if Morrissey is a bit more cutting when writing about Marr? Has no one ever considered Stop Me is about Marr? A song about a man who goes out drinking every night and then lies to his girlfriend/wife about it.

My reasoning is Marr has been very open about his heavy drinking at the time. He later admitted that one of the reasons he left the Smiths was because it and his behaviour was putting his marriage in danger.

According to people close to the band at the time Morrissey spent a fair amount of time with Marr's wife who worked as an unofficial assistant to the band. What if Stop Me is Morrissey telling Marr to sort himself out and be nicer to his wife?

edit: sorry Worm just seen you have considered it. You're the first person I've ever known to.

That's funny, I thought I'd be battered for even vaguely suggesting it. I think your interpretation about the drinking fits. The beauty is that the song can be listened to either way and it's still brilliant.

If it is true, it's a sign that Morrissey would only write songs to or about Johnny in disguise, as it were. Messages only he could really get. Which makes it interesting to go back and think about which ones they could be, although ultimately it's fruitless to seek them out.
 
I remember hearing that Emelio Estevez and Charlie Sheen pretended to be feuding just to mess with the media. That sounds fine and good, though why anyone would care what either of them does is beyond me. The problem is that it's really the fans that you're screwing with, and the media is perfectly happy to print and sell to your fans everything you want to say. If you change your story all the time the media is more than happy to repackage the new quote and put it out there for people to buy. I'm not sure M&M do it on purpose, or at least not often. When they do, I think they're probably talking to each other through the media as often as not. The "Marr won't rule out reunion" is a complete non-story, but there it is. What else could he have said? Every new word choice becomes a story. (On the other hand, didn't he say he wasn't going to answer that question anymore and that he was writing a book?)

I'm curious what Morrissey has said about songs being about Marr, though Morrissey being Morrissey I wouldn't necessarily believe what he says anyway. I know Johnny has come right out and said "I Won't Share You" isn't about him. Lyle Lovett has said that everyone thinks every song he's done post-Julia (Roberts, not Moz's Julia) is about her. I think he's said only one song really is, and I forget which one.

In terms of the Morrissey-Marr relationship, it must be a bit weird for them to keep being asked about the other. Can you imagine if you were constantly peppered with questions about someone from your distant past, when you're going to see them, do you keep in touch and why not? How often do you even think of those people?

So you think it's about Lyle Lovett?
 
Actually, he outright said it was about Marr. I'm not sure which interview this quote was originally taken from, it appears in a Mojo article:

Morrissey: Angel, Angel, Down We Go Together was written with Johnny Marr in mind and it is the only song that I have written with him in mind, post Smiths. I saw him in the music industry being used and being manipulated and I felt I was in a similar situation.

Oh, that's right. I thought he had said something about that but wasn't sure. Thanks for posting.

I'm still not convinced that the song isn't about The Smiths. Obviously the song is overtly about his experiences outside the band, in his youth, but I find it too coincidental that it should appear on his first solo album.
 
Lyle Hatett would be a good punk name if anyone was still paying attention to Lyle Lovett.
 
I'm curious as I've never made that connection, however reading the thread it seems like many fans agree with you. Could you explain to me (briefly) why you think the songs are about Morrissey and Marr's relationship specifically? I found Morrissey's music in '93, so it was after The Smiths broke up. I guess I never thought that the relationship with Johnny was being explained in his songs. It serves to reason, and I'm daft to not have considered it in the past. Any help for a jumped up pantry boy would be greatly appreciated...

Angel Angel Down We Go Together - Moz admitted this was about Marr in an interview.

There Speaks A True Friend - Got to be about Marr getting angry with Moz towards the end of The Smiths. "You told me all the things....people cannot stand about me....I just wish you'd STAYED AROUND" (instead of leaving the band). I also think the sarcastic line about asking where he'd be without his friends to help him is his way of telling us about the time post-Smiths, pre-The Lads where he's dealing with not knowing where he goes musically.

Billy Budd - "Yeah, but now it's 12 years on...yes and I took up with you" song was released on V&I in 1994 - Morrissey took up with Marr in 1982! And the sample at the end - "don't leave us in the dark" - is Morrissey sending a message to Marr asking him to get back into contact with him again.

Disappointed - "Young boy...I wanna help you, but see these lines?" i.e. I want to get The Smiths back together, but listen to this song - I'm still disappointed with you for leaving in the first place. I don't think this song is solely about Marr but I certainly think there's some of it in there.

I Don't Mind If You Forget Me - Self-explanatory really. It's the last song on Viva Hate. Viva Hate was basically Morrissey's musical response to the end of The Smiths. This song I think is Morrissey being characteristically stubborn - he claims not to mind if Marr moves on, but really Morrissey is left longing for a reunion and wonders why they no longer remained close bandmates - "your mild 'best wishes', they make me suspicious...".

I Keep Mine Hidden - I think several other users have explained what this song is about earlier in this thread.

I Won't Share You - One of the reasons The Smiths broke up was because Morrissey was becoming annoyed at Marr collaborating with other artists. He saw Marr as "his" guitarist and couldn't stand it that not all of his concentration was going into The Smiths. Also, he probably sub-conciously realised whilst writing this song that Marr was planning on leaving the group, but wanted the two to get back together at some point in the future, possibly with Rourke and Joyce as The Smiths, maybe not, hence the line "I'll see you somewhere, I'll see you sometime, darling...". To date, of course, this has never happened.
 
It never would occur to me that "I don't mind if you forget me" would be about Johnny Marr. I think it "rejection from a fool is cruel" fits in with thoughts like "on the day that your mentality catches up with your biology" just as well. Unrequited lust.

Disappointed, I don't think so, either. It has so many other things happening besides, "I'm disappointed".

I always thought "our unsleepable friend" is Morrissey referring to himself. By that time he was already older than most of the people that were buying his records so he's offering some observations.

I always thought "people who were nice" were fake people that you meet who pretend to be nice, but reading the notes again, I see that it could something else. Sort of another version of "I'm so sick and tired and I'm feeling very sick and ill today but I'm still fond of you"
 
It never would occur to me that "I don't mind if you forget me" would be about Johnny Marr. I think it "rejection from a fool is cruel" fits in with thoughts like "on the day that your mentality catches up with your biology" just as well. Unrequited lust.

Disappointed, I don't think so, either. It has so many other things happening besides, "I'm disappointed".

I always thought "our unsleepable friend" is Morrissey referring to himself. By that time he was already older than most of the people that were buying his records so he's offering some observations.

I always thought "people who were nice" were fake people that you meet who pretend to be nice, but reading the notes again, I see that it could something else. Sort of another version of "I'm so sick and tired and I'm feeling very sick and ill today but I'm still fond of you"

One of the reasons I like "Viva Hate" so much is that it shows Morrissey at his most clever: evasive, witty, a master of the indirect.

Following on my comment about "Break Up The Family", above, in my opinion many of the songs on "Viva Hate" can be listened to as being largely about The Smiths' breakup or as a series of totally unrelated reflections on his pre-Smiths past. Songs like 'Family' and 'I Don't Mind' are bursting with subtext about The Smiths but it's also very easy to think they're not about The Smiths at all. Morrissey got away with saying everything people expected him to say-- sadness, despair, anger, contentment, and so on-- without actually saying it.
 
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