Morrissey interview + Polaroid photo in German Spiegel magazine

"Ich bin für Klartext" - Spiegel Online

(Excerpt before paywall via Google Translate)

Morrissey's worldview "I'm for plain text"


"Morrissey praises the Brexit referendum, defends Kevin Spacey and calls Berlin a "rape capital" because of its open borders. seriously?"

Whether the Briton Steven Patrick Morrissey, 58, a musician just Morrissey calls, now Genius is or Schrat, self-actor or choleric poet, will probably never settle final. Certainly the man from Manchester, who became famous in the eighties as a singer of pop band The Smiths, is a great eccentric of pop. Whether concert or interview, he maintains the pose of the diva. The meeting took place on the occasion of his new album "Low in High School" in Los Angeles; It was arranged at very short notice and then postponed several times, domination gestures want to be maintained. After all, Morrissey is ready to talk. However, the photographer is referred by one of his managers rude of the room: "Get out of my hotel!" The Polaroid photo was taken by the interviewer.

An interview with Juliane Liebert

41404_morrissey-spiegel.jpg


SPIEGEL: Mr Morrissey, in your new song "Spent the Day in Bed", you recommend that you no longer see any news. A serious proposal?

Morrissey: Yes. People should stop doing so for their own sanity. You have to stop. The news is just social engineering, and it's about control, not information. There are no more messages. Only control.

SPIEGEL: That sounds like Trump's fake news, but you just spoke out against Trump at a concert.

Morrissey: Trump has received so much attention, especially when compared to other candidates - Bernie Sanders, for example. Although the media said he will not win, every day, all the headlines: Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump! The American media helped Trump, yes, they first created it. Whether they criticize him or laugh at him, he does not care, he just wants to see his picture and his name. The American media have shot themselves in the leg. Since he was in power, he has exhausted the world. He grabs after everything like a little child. He is not a leader. He is a vermin. A huge vermin.

SPIEGEL: Do you think that he will be re-elected?


Full transcript (Google Translate to English), original German text posted by Cornflakes


Media coverage:
 
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Edgar Allan Poe married his 13-year old cousin. I'm never buying one of his albums again.

Jerry Lee Lewis:
Lewis's turbulent personal life was hidden from the public until a May 1958 British tour where Ray Berry, a news agency reporter at London's Heathrow Airport (the only journalist present), learned about Lewis's third wife, Myra Gale Brown. She was Lewis's first cousin once removed and was only 13 years old at the time. (Brown, Lewis, and his management all insisted that she was 15.) Lewis was 22 years old.
 
This is an appalling interview. Depressing. Morrissey - I'm done.
 
Elvis:
Most famously there was his future wife, Priscilla Beaulieu, who was just 14 - ten years his junior - when they met in September 1959. Although sexual from the start, their relationship was portrayed as a sweet and innocent triumph of love across the age divide. In fact, it was just one of Presley's many unsettling liaisons with minors in the years following his rise to fame.

'He was fascinated with the idea of real young teenage girls,' said Lamar Fike, a former member of his entourage. 'It scared the hell out of all of us.'


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lationships-virginal-girls.html#ixzz4ypPd7K5a
 
'if david bowie was into underage girls you would hear from far more than people than just one. and it's not like david bowie went out on the prowl expressly looking for some young girl. she probably just happened to be there. not that any of that makes it right, but it certainly doesnt make him a predator or pederast or anything like that.'

Is once not enough to define someone as a 'pederast' ? I'm not saying that it is, and yes we have no record that he was habitually going out of his way looking just for the groupies that were underage. And yes, drugs or a combination of drugs can impair ones better judgment. But is that really an alibi for ones actions?

:cool:

'she will be your living end'

oops, i used the word pederast wrong (i thought it applied to those males attracted to someone underage but past the age of puberty. is there a word for such a person?). how embarassing!

okay, well i dont know what word to use then, because a man who finds a 15 year old attractive is clearly not the same as a man who finds a 5 year old attractive and there needs to be some distinction. but anyway, no i dont think once is enough. it doesnt form a pattern. to be a pedophile or whatever, there's usually a pattern. it's a preference. pedophiles find young people attractive because they are young. which is a wholly different thing than finding a young person who resembles a grown up and acts like a grown up to be attractive. however queasy it seems, the latter is actually quite normal, biologically speaking. i remember a vogue piece about the model isabeli fontana who was 15 at the time it was written. the photographer or whoever was following her around that day, described her pictures as being sexy and than quickly said he felt a bit ashamedly humbert humbertian for saying so, which was followed with a swift defence from someone or other that actually humbert humbert was attracted to lolita because she embodied youth, whereas in her photos isabeli looked like an adult and thus it was not the same thing at all. also, a pedophile is not able to have sexual relationships with grown women and as we have seen david bowie had no problem with that. i think what david bowie did under the circumstances, though icky, was quite normal in his situation.
 
I just read a different report here http://www.vulture.com/2017/11/kevin-spacey-alleged-sexual-relationship.html

excerpt below... (is this false then ?)

'He told me to come over, and I went to the apartment. And I thought we were going to kiss and tell each other we loved each other and I was going to go. But he wanted to have sex, and this time he wanted to f*** me, which had never happened to me before.


He said he wanted to top you?
He did not say. He just did. I guess he must have come up behind me and yanked down my baggy jeans, and he goes to f*** me and I’m like, “No, I don’t want to.” And he pushes hard, and grabs me, and starts shoving up against my asshole, and it hurts like a motherf***er. I again tell him no, and he tries again. I am strong enough, thank God, both somewhere in my brain and in my body, to get him off of me. I’m sturdy, thankfully. I throw him off of me and I run crying down the stairs and out into the street and then suck it all up and go have dinner.'


btw, I do agree with most of your post.

That is not an interview with Rapp. That is an anonymous interview with someone who has come forward since Rapp made his statement...and honestly, I don't believe someone who was a victim of an attempted rape would recount the experience with phrases like "And he pushes hard, and grabs me, and starts shoving up against my asshole, and it hurts like a motherf***er."

Honestly, it comes off more like some Destiel rape fantasy fanfic.

What a vile interview. And how depressing that right-wing hate mongerers like Shyness Is Nice and Viva Hate seem to form an increasingly outspoken part of his diminishing fanbase.



Faced with semi-intelligent questions face to face for the first time in years he shows his true ignorance and contradictory nature. "If you want respect, you have to protect your country"? Well, how does that rhyme with the message of I Bury The Living? And Who Will Protect Us From The Police? So suddenly armies and the police are a good thing?

The "true" ignorance here is your lack of reading comprehension.

I love it that Moz speaks his mind and doesnt give a f*** who he upsets. Pretty much agree with everything he says on Spacey. The whole thing has become a witch hunt - when did we go back to Victorian values on sex? When I was a teenager someone grabbing your crotch was a good night out. I dont agree with everything Moz says on immigration but I respect his right to say it - there is very much a media agenda and message that multiculturalism is great and we should all embrace it. Moz clearly doesnt share that message - he and millions of others - but that view is almost completely absent from mainstream media. Europe is going down the pan and we ignore that at our peril...

It is absent from the media because it contradicts the message they have been hammering into your skull the last 15 years.

The parents.
I know they can’t guard their child 24 hrs. a day but come on 14 yrs old he should be at home or they should at least know where he was going.

He is a child.
I thought Moz mentioned the parents as first being responsible for takin care of their kid as he was trying to understand why and how and comparing it to when he was 14 yrs old.

Parents are barely parents these days...it is just generation after generation of undisciplined, self-centered children shatting out a worse version of themselves.

YEAH! Let's get real about sexual assault - let folk in power grab who the hell they like, regardless of whether they asked for it. And f*** IMMIGRANTS! Yeah! How dare we have compassion for those in need.

You're such a drama queen, Skinny. He's talking about a lack of assimilation, not an end to immigration.

old fashioned? no, i would say that's very modern. go back 100, 200 years. children were going off to war. there was no such thing as this prolonged adolescence that we have these days.

And people died in their 30s. And cousins married cousins. And 14 year-olds were being married. People seem to forget where they come from...by today's standards, we were all birthed somewhere down the line by the union of a pedophile and a victim of sexual assault.

That's the problem with growing old. Many people become more insulated, and fearful about the changing world around them, until they no longer make sense in a modern era. The world has always changed. Cultures have always changed. People come, and go, and no amount of resentment will change it. It will just drag you down, and make you look like an aged cliche.

And the problem with being young is that you think you know everything without actually knowing a goddamn thing.

Morrissey, a man who never had the guts to come out of the closet, has no problem being honest about things he knows little about.

The guts to come out of the closet? Lol. What business is it to anyone? Why would he have to? So some idiots can project on him? So some sad little twink can feel good about himself? Get a life.

Yeah, to hell with substance. Let's just recite every inane thought that passes through our heads because that's what makes for a civil society where important issues are treated with tact, and consideration.

It's a sure recipe for bringing people together, and it's doing a great job of solving the current problems we are facing. People are as outspoken today and they have ever been, and the world is full of cooperation.

Somehow, I don't think spouting ignorance as a from of catharsis is going to make many other people happy, besides the speaker.

We once cherished tact in public for a reason. The Internet has abolished it as a standard for discourse. Have fun with the aftermath.

The reality is, until people start to feel the fallout for their callous remarks, it will continue unabated.

We're already seeing signs that the pendulum is swinging back, and many people are going to have a hard time explaining themselves in the future. Good luck.

How is that "world full of cooperation" working out for you, bro?

"Millions of people have died for German identity"

Does he mean the millions slaughtered as a result of Germans trying to create a Jew free 1000 year Reich and "living space" in Eastern Europe?

No. He doesn't.

why does it take people 20 years to report these things,because they know there could be a pot of gold at the end.

It helps when you've got a tv show to promote.

The UK and Brexit are two different things by the way, and it's no coincidence that he sings Brexit at the end. Let's agree to disagree.

You do understand that he doesn't sing "Brexit" at the end!

You must be part of the minority that can't hear 'Brexit' on the live BBC 6 session, or on the studio version.

I must be because I can't hear it at all.

Get yourself a pair of high quality headphones and you will hear it :thumb: Last I am saying on it now :head-smack:

He isn't singing Brexit.

The media seems to have free rein to judge and execute people without the need of a trial.

Exactly.

I'm confused, are we now saying the many sexual attacks in Cologne one New Year's Eve, reportedly by immigrants, did not actually happen after all? No one believes most Muslims are terrorists or rapists but there is a problem in many areas of the UK too.

But...but...thats racist! :rolleyes:

Let us know what you think about this situation: The kid for any reason doesn't leave "on his own free wil". He stays and Spacey has sex with a 14 y.o. boy. Would you say he didn't rape him? Children's sexual consent doesn't exist. What is Spacey supposed to be when he was going to have sex with a child? No wonder why he needs urgent help.

Yes, I would say he didn't rape him...just as the law sees a difference. Which is why statutory rape laws exist.

Ah ok I hadn’t realised Spacey has admitted it.

He hasn't.

Legally, yes. It fits the definition. The 14 year old was legally a child. It is entirely inappropriate to lie on top of a 14 year old boy.

Inappropriate? Yes...but is it illegal?

Current New York state law:

Non-intercourse sexual activity, called "sexual contact" is defined as "any touching of the sexual or other intimate parts of a person not married to the actor for the purpose of gratifying sexual desire of either party. It includes the touching of the actor by the victim, as well as the touching of the victim by the actor, whether directly or through clothing." (NY Penal Law § 130.00[3].)
  • "Sexual contact" with a person less than 17 but at least 14, by a perpetrator who is at least five years older than the victim is "Sexual abuse in the third degree," a class B misdemeanor. (NY Penal Law § 130.55.)
As Spacey did not touch Rapp's "intimate parts", what exact crime did he commit? Even if he had touched his genitals, it would only be considered a misdemeanor.

Well, we are, I think, three years on from the Cologne New Year attacks and nigh on a year from the Berlin Christmas market Truck of Peace.

Add Hebdo, the Bataclan, Nice, Manchester, Westminster Bridge, London Bridge and others and I don’t think it is unfair for the people of Europe to ask just what the hell is going on?

Two weeks ago I watched a Channel Four News story in which it was suggested with a straight face we should welcome ISIS fighters back to the UK with free council houses and all the trimmings, and by so doing hope they don’t try to kill anyone. Not letting them back in was, by comparison, considered horrifyingly illiberal.

This.

Trump is against illegal immigration not just Mexican illegal immigration and so was every other US president before him. On Mexico's border with Guatemala Mexican soldiers stand guard and have orders to shoot to kill anyone crossing into their country illegally. Quite different than the USA. Steve did nothing to market to the Mexicans, they just started liking him in California, so Steve capitalized on it and it helps that he lives in the city that has the most Mexicans in the USA.

The media loves to blur the lines between immigration and illegal immigration. They don't even use the term "illegal immigrants" anymore on the news. For a perfect example of how the media is, look no further than Uncleskinny's posts on this forum...just blanket generalizations and browbeating in order to guilt you into their point of view.

Yea, if you got the part you aint complaining. :rock:
Everything that went down was cool. Nothing untoward took place LOL

I feel if you gave your pussy up for a career advancement, you don't have the right to complain about it later.

Not to mention Oscar Wilde, who was also keen on underage boys ;)

People seem to forget that.

I'm not condoning Spacey's actions here and it is every adults responsibility to know what is right and what is wrong.
From reading the posts in this thread some people seem to be misinformed about what actually happened. I already posted a link to the Vulture article and so here I'm posting excerpts and a link for the full article on Rapp's story of his friendship and sexual relationship with Spacey.

'When the accuser was 14, Spacey gave him his phone number and asked him to come to his apartment. “He said he’d always been really drawn to me at the acting classes, but had stayed away because I was 12,” the man recalled. He alleged that they “started a sexual relationship that first visit, which mostly involved me f--king him.”

They met three or four times after that, proclaiming that they “loved each other,” he said. Spacey allegedly also promised the teenager that producers were interested in him as an actor and said he wanted to get him auditions. None of that ever came to fruition.

The relationship continued until the man was 15, ending after a visit during which Spacey allegedly tried to rape him. “I thought we were going to kiss and tell each other we loved each other and I was going to go,” he said. “But he wanted to have sex, and this time he wanted to f--k me, which had never happened to me before.”

Here’s how he described the alleged attempted rape to Vulture:

I guess he must have come up behind me and yanked down my baggy jeans, and he goes to f--k me and I’m like, “No, I don’t want to.” And he pushes hard, and grabs me, and starts shoving up against my asshole, and it hurts like a motherf--ker. I again tell him no, and he tries again. I am strong enough, thank God, both somewhere in my brain and in my body, to get him off of me. I’m sturdy, thankfully. I throw him off of me and I run crying down the stairs and out into the street and then suck it all up and go have dinner.'

excerpts from https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/11/kevin-spacey-attempted-rape-allegations

And as I said before, the only person spreading misinformation is you. That is not Anthony Rapp's account of events.
 
John Ruskin (the greatest English art critic ever lived):
Ruskin's later relationship with Rose La Touche has led to claims that he was a paedophile, on the grounds that he stated that he fell in love with her when he met her at the age of nine. ...
During an episode of mental derangement after Rose died, he wrote a letter in which he insisted that Rose's spirit had instructed him to marry a girl who was visiting him at the time. It is also true that in letters from Ruskin to Kate Greenaway he asked her to draw her "girlies" (as he called her child figures) without clothing:

Will you – (it’s all for your own good – !) make her stand up and then draw her for me without a cap – and, without her shoes, – (because of the heels) and without her mittens, and without her – frock and frills? And let me see exactly how tall she is – and – how – round. It will be so good of and for you – And to and for me.

In a letter to his physician John Simon on 15 May 1886, Ruskin wrote:

I like my girls from ten to sixteen—allowing of 17 or 18 as long as they’re not in love with anybody but me.—I’ve got some darlings of 8—12—14—just now, and my Pigwiggina here—12—who fetches my wood and is learning to play my bells
 
On the immigration/assimilation angle as per my personal experience-

Growing up in Oregon, it was incredibly white when I was a child. There were rumors of the KKK persisting in a nearby town, there was an absolute plague of Nazi Skinheads in the late 80s to early 90s, racial epithets were said in public, not behind closed doors, and it was accepted. Probably when I was about 10 or so, there started to be a steady influx of Latino immigrants, who eventually took over what was previously the really rough side of my town.

Some of them assimilated, took to American culture, customs, learned and spoke English. Others brought a slice of home with them, and opened businesses, kept up tradition, and lived alongside the longtime residents without really being engaged by/engaging with them. I frequent many of their businesses (I have a weak spot for Pan Dulce) and am treated well. I've picked up enough fragments of conversational Spanish to communicate at a rudimentary level, or at least bridge the gap in customer situations. I like what this brings to my city. Same with the Asians and Russians that are making up an increasing amount of the population.

This is where I'm confused by Morrissey on the topic of immigration/assimilation. He obviously embraces Latino culture and immigration, assimilation or no, based on his band, his life in LA, etc. So it creates a real disconnect for me to hear him gripe about other countries, that they have thrown away their identity etc.
How is he for one people, but against another? Borders are ridiculous. Identity is ridiculous. The world has opened and given opportunity to people who previously had none, so of course we all blend together. That's the simple end result of technology and medicine meeting overpopulation and a "smaller" world.
 
Not to mention Oscar Wilde, who was also keen on underage boys ;)

Actually there is no evidence at all that Oscar had sex with 'underage' boys - although the term underage back then had no meaning as all sex between men was considered 'gross misconduct' regardless of age. All the rent boys Oscar paid for sex were over the age of 18. At least as far as the evidence given at his trials. But the comparison is similar - a talented career brought low by sexual impropriety, with all the associated hysteria and calumny.
 
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On the immigration/assimilation angle as per my personal experience-

Growing up in Oregon, it was incredibly white when I was a child. There were rumors of the KKK persisting in a nearby town, there was an absolute plague of Nazi Skinheads in the late 80s to early 90s, racial epithets were said in public, not behind closed doors, and it was accepted. Probably when I was about 10 or so, there started to be a steady influx of Latino immigrants, who eventually took over what was previously the really rough side of my town.

Some of them assimilated, took to American culture, customs, learned and spoke English. Others brought a slice of home with them, and opened businesses, kept up tradition, and lived alongside the longtime residents without really being engaged by/engaging with them. I frequent many of their businesses (I have a weak spot for Pan Dulce) and am treated well. I've picked up enough fragments of conversational Spanish to communicate at a rudimentary level, or at least bridge the gap in customer situations. I like what this brings to my city. Same with the Asians and Russians that are making up an increasing amount of the population.

This is where I'm confused by Morrissey on the topic of immigration/assimilation. He obviously embraces Latino culture and immigration, assimilation or no, based on his band, his life in LA, etc. So it creates a real disconnect for me to hear him gripe about other countries, that they have thrown away their identity etc.
How is he for one people, but against another? Borders are ridiculous. Identity is ridiculous. The world has opened and given opportunity to people who previously had none, so of course we all blend together. That's the simple end result of technology and medicine meeting overpopulation and a "smaller" world.

You are saying this from an American perspective (rightly so) but the size of the UK compared to America is huge. If the same number of immigrants went to America as they did in the UK, you would not necessarily see or feel the effects of it in America as you would in the UK. We are a small island and we can't cope with the current numbers we have. Not to mention the lack of integration.
 
and also a lot of these artists were on drugs at the time and maybe didnt know what they were doing and, also, probably werent asking ages. i remember this dumb girl at work telling me that about the 15 year old, just after david bowie died and i had just confessed how upset i was about it, as though this was proof that david bowie was a really bad character with a taste for fifteen year olds. it does nothing of the sort. if david bowie was into underage girls you would hear from far more than people than just one. and it's not like david bowie went out on the prowl expressly looking for some young girl. she probably just happened to be there. not that any of that makes it right, but it certainly doesnt make him a predator or pederast or anything like that.

I can ease your mind a little bit there. The groupie in question (she would actually have been 14) has told the story at least five times in five different versions. Not slightly different in the odd detail but radically different. Totally different stories about how she came to meet Bowie (by chance in a restaurant, she was approached by his bodyguard at his gig at Long Beach, she received a phonecall inviting her to meet him, she and her friend snuck into his hotel room). One version where it happens in a different year to the others. One version where she spends the whole evening with him until the next morning, on a day where there are a couple of thousand witnesses to the fact that he was performing at the Hollywood Palladium. There's also another groupie, a friend of the first, who has told a story where she is with them the whole time and it's actually her, not the first groupie, who has sex with Bowie. All told, none of it is evidence for anything.
 
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You have a greater chance of being raped, or killed by your naturally born neighbor than by an immigrant.

No one's ignoring rapes by immigrants. They're just not treating it as a form of panic for political purposes. Bad people break laws. We p[prosecute them.

Let me guess, you think Sharia Law is going to replace common law?

f***ing people...

Oh, that IS such a great relief. Thank you. I didn’t know.
Tell it to the many, many girls and women of Cologne, of several places in Sweden and several other places in Europe where it all was denied and played down, just like in Cologne.

They will be grateful and realise it wasn’t that bad after all.

You forgot to mention more people dying in traffic cause the rape victims are still alive so there is always somebody that is worse of. Innit?
 
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Tell it to the many, many girls and women of Cologne, of several places in Sweden and several other places in Europe where it all was denied and played down, just like un Cologne.

They will be grateful and realise it wasn’t that bad after all.

How do you know that it was played down? I'm not saying it was or it wasn't, but how is it you know?
 
No but it’s a fuzzier picture than many anti immigration believiera often make it out to be. It is an extreme over reaction exaggeration though. Rape captitol of the world it is absolutely factually not

The fuzzier picture was created on purpose by authorities by innitialy denying it happened.

I am not convinced that has changed.
 
You are saying this from an American perspective (rightly so) but the size of the UK compared to America is huge. If the same number of immigrants went to America as they did in the UK, you would not necessarily see or feel the effects of it in America as you would in the UK. We are a small island and we can't cope with the current numbers we have. Not to mention the lack of integration.
I'm saying this from a purely local perspective, and my town is quite smaller than the UK, so I am using it as a microcosm in this example. My town went from 80,000 to nearly 300,000 from then to now, so yes, I feel much more crowded now, and the green spaces are growing smaller by the year as the entire place turns to one huge strip mall housing project sprawl.

I'm not saying it was without growing pains. I've heard the argument that "Mexicans are taking our jobs! Ruining our schools! Bringing drugs and crime!" Plenty. PLENTY. What I'm saying, is that with time, it becomes normal, and the racists and fear-mongers grow old, die off, and are replaced by more progressive thinking. The trap in aging is that so many get poisoned by their own nostalgia of what a place is, or means. It's something different to everybody, and change is scary for some. It seems like Morrissey yearns for a past that is disappearing, where everybody can be comfortably fit into categories and places. But if he were returned to the England of his youth, he'd probably think it's shit. With or without all of those pesky immigrants destroying the English identity. Nostalgia is a dangerous thing when it comes to how a person relates to the world around them.
 
That is not an interview with Rapp. That is an anonymous interview with someone who has come forward since Rapp

And as I said before, the only person spreading misinformation is you. That is not Anthony Rapp's account of events.

yes, someone already corrected me and I deleted that post a while ago. And I never said that you were spreading false information, I just asked if the articles that I was reading of the incident are the same as the one you mentioned in your post. And later I found out that I was mistaking the incidents of two different accusers. Peace, !VH! :)
 
I'm saying this from a purely local perspective, and my town is quite smaller than the UK, so I am using it as a microcosm in this example. My town went from 80,000 to nearly 300,000 from then to now, so yes, I feel much more crowded now, and the green spaces are growing smaller by the year as the entire place turns to one huge strip mall housing project sprawl.

I'm not saying it was without growing pains. I've heard the argument that "Mexicans are taking our jobs! Ruining our schools! Bringing drugs and crime!" Plenty. PLENTY. What I'm saying, is that with time, it becomes normal, and the racists and fear-mongers grow old, die off, and are replaced by more progressive thinking. The trap in aging is that so many get poisoned by their own nostalgia of what a place is, or means. It's something different to everybody, and change is scary for some. It seems like Morrissey yearns for a past that is disappearing, where everybody can be comfortably fit into categories and places. But if he were returned to the England of his youth, he'd probably think it's shit. With or without all of those pesky immigrants destroying the English identity. Nostalgia is a dangerous thing when it comes to how a person relates to the world around them.
If the people are happy with mass immigration (their decision) fine, but when the politicians decide for us and impose it on us without our consent, then I have a BIG problem.
 
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