Johnny Marr; 'Morrissey and I email!'

[Jones]

I agree that it wouldn't hurt Marr to say something nice about Morrissey occasionally. There does seem to be a real reluctance on his part to give Morrissey too much credit.

 

[Worm]

but he is asked often questions like "who is your favorite collaborator/frontman/singer/lyrist? Who did you enjoy working with most what is your favorite song/album?"

I spent a few minutes Googling Johnny Marr interviews earlier today, and I posted a few quotes. Can you do the same for this? I'm not trying to be a pest. I know of several statements he's made about Bernard Sumner (I don't deny he's made catty comments about Morrissey) but my sincere impression, from years of reading Johnny Marr interviews with great interest, is that these catty comments are few and far between-- and there are more than enough nice comments to balance them out.

When given these chances he rarely if ever gives Morrissey credit - credit goes else where far more often.

But for reasons I've stated. He doesn't want to overshadow his current collaborators. I think you'll find that Morrissey doesn't give credit to Johnny very often. Nor does he talk fondly of his own older work, solo or Smiths. If I'm not mistaken, Morrissey called "You Are The Quarry" his best album ever. Then he said that about "Ringleaders". And again about "Years of Refusal". Neither of them spends much time talking up the past.

I just get the feeling marr would love a reunion he'd love another chance at generation defining greatness and he knows he can only achieve it with Morrissey - I maybe wrong but its the picture i get from these dumb answers he gives.

I don't. I don't see any difference between the flip answers he gives and the ones Morrissey gives ("I'd sooner eat my own testicles"). I can't prove you're wrong but I will say that I think your interpretation is a case of "reading between the lines" and mine is based on what Marr actually says. Why shouldn't we take Johnny at his word?

really? I not sure - even you believe its true - why does marr have it so wrong? ... This is clearly the case then, he's definition of sucess differs from mine - maybe thats it, he is delluded - me and you and everybody else knows the truth though right?

Yeah, but when can any artist evaluate his own work accurately? I don't expect Morrissey, Marr, or anyone else to agree with my assessment. Dan Brown probably thinks he's the greatest popular novelist since Dickens-- I disagree, but I wouldn't expect him to agree with me, let alone volunteer his agreement in print!

The reason I've focused on Marr's own definition of success is to argue that Marr does not feel any real need to play with Morrissey again, for a one-off gig or a couple of singles or whatever. I'm not saying Marr is right about his self-evaluation. I'm saying he may be telling the truth when he says he doesn't care about one more shot at "generation-defining greatness", as you put it. I really don't think he cares. He and Morrissey defined their generation twenty years ago. A generation defined once is defined forever. It's done. It's over with.

he enjoys working with others more, and thinks they are better, even stating the latest cribs album was as satifying to work on as THE BEST of the Smiths? lol

Hey, I agree with you. It sounds ridiculous to me, too. I'm not really interested in rendering a judgment on whether or not he's correct, merely in what he believes is correct.

instead of constantly hearing about bernard - wouldn't you?

No. I don't need to hear him say it. We all know it. He knows it. As I said he doesn't want to overshadow his current bandmates. That's fair and understandable. I guarantee you that a day will come when Marr will make a grand and definitive statement of admiration, affection, and respect for Morrissey. I think Marr will be about, oh, 85 years old when that happens. But so what?

And also I have to quibble with your use of the word "constantly". He's talked up Bernard a few times, mostly in a lighthearted way. He hasn't "constantly" praised Bernard at Morrissey's expense.

he left - even he says it himself - even if he had felt pushed he didn't have to leave

By way of response, read this:

"My big memory of The Queen Is Dead," says Johnny Marr, "is being behind the mixing desk at about half 12 in the morning. We had all this elation going on, a real high, and it was, How about his on the verse, and this on the chorus? There was also some shit going on about us being out of our Rough Trade contract.

"Morrissey had been talking to a lawyer about it. This guy was the biggest clichéd textbook, we didn't like him at all. He called me up. It was a closed session, not easy to get through to us — but he managed it. He said, 'I'm working on this, Johnny, but we may be looking at an injunction on this record.' I'm a quarter of the way into climbing this mountain, and I've got this wanker telling me Rough Trade are going to injunct the record. I was like, (Sarcastically) Great, fantastic.

"Then the phone went about three-quarters of an hour later, and it was this guy Jay from Rough Trade — who was a sweet guy — to tell me that Salford Van Hire had been on to Rough Trade, and because our roadie had brought the van back two days later than we'd paid for, they were going to sue as well, and we needed a lawyer's address. I was like, Jay — f*** off. And I went back to climbing the mountain. That was the one of the first times I took a picture in my mind, and thought, This is insane."

- Mojo, April 2001​

 

[Worm]

I agree that it wouldn't hurt Marr to say something nice about Morrissey occasionally. There does seem to be a real reluctance on his part to give Morrissey too much credit.

Does Morrissey come out in interviews and talk about Johnny Marr as the best guitarist, producer, and songwriter in the world? Why not?

Could it be because his collaborators, like Johnny's, read newspapers and web sites like everyone else?

 

[Black Cloud]

Dear Internet,

Please don't let The Smiths reunite, especially not in a tragic one-off lumbering Rock n Roll Hall Of Fame-esque free for all.

Your Friend,

Black Cloud

 

[Maurice E]

Does Morrissey come out in interviews and talk about Johnny Marr as the best guitarist, producer, and songwriter in the world? Why not?
Could it be because his collaborators, like Johnny's, read newspapers and web sites like everyone else?

You're really wrong on this one, Worm.
Marr has hardly ever said a single positive thing about Morrissey's solo career. The only exception is for 'The Last of the Famous International Playboys'.
Much of what he's said could be interpreted as snide comments. He doesn't listen to modern Moz songs coz he knows what they're gonna sound like. He doesn't listen to modern Moz coz it's not his kind of thing.
Who's the best vocalists Morrissey or Curtis? "Tricky one but I'd go for Curtis" (or words to that effect). Unbelievable!
Can you imagine Morrissey being asked who's the better guitarist, Marr or Edge, and him replying Edge? Of course you flipping couldn't!
Morrissey said that Marr hasn't been equalled. Morrissey dedicated his Ivor Novello to Marr (or at least thanked him specifically).
With the exception of a comment about an early Electronic song, Moz hasn't said anything unpleasant about post-Smiths Marr; quite the reverse (see the praise he gave Marr in the notorious NME immigration interview).
To say that Marr and Moz have been equally supportive/positive about each other in their post Smiths years is just nonsense.

 

[Worm]

Dear Internet,

Please don't let The Smiths reunite, especially not in a tragic one-off lumbering Rock n Roll Hall Of Fame-esque free for all.

Your Friend,

Black Cloud

Rolling Stone - September 2011 - Reporting From Cleveland

The Smiths were enshrined into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in high style Saturday night. Appearing onstage together for the first time in 24 years, Morrissey and Johnny Marr electrified the crowd with an acceptance speech that was humorous and emotional in equal measure.

"I'd be a corpse rotting in the bowels of a library somewhere in Manchester if he hadn't knocked on my door", said Morrissey, visibly fighting tears.

"Morrissey, we were equal partners, but I have to say, in your words, the pleasure and the privilege were mine", Marr answered.

At the conclusion of the speech, Morrissey and Marr were joined by former bassist Andy Rourke and drummer Zak Starkey (filling in for an absent Mike Joyce) for a rousing mini-set of Smiths classics.

Surprise guest stars poured from the wings to jam with the legends from Manchester who many consider the best band of the Eighties.

Carlos Santana played a rousing six-minute solo during "Shoplifters Of The World Unite". Elton John played piano on "A Rush And A Push And The Land Is Ours". Tom Petty added some acoustic guitar while Johnny Marr sang a rowdy version of "Asleep", with Morrissey sporting a quizzical look as he banged a tambourine from the side of the stage.

Bruce Springsteen paid tribute to The Smiths before "This Charming Man". "I didn't even know where Manchester was on a map before The Smiths came along. That's the power of rock and roll, man".

Coldplay's Christ Martin was even more emphatic. Pointing to Morrissey, Martin simply shook his head and said, "This guy. This guy. This guy is the reason".

The highlight of the set was a blistering, heart-breaking rendition of "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out". Morrissey introduced the song by giving out the web address to the iTunes Store for a free download. "Please go and download a free live track from iTunes.com, and thanks to Apple for sponsoring this year's show", the graying singer intoned before Phil Collins, guesting on sticks, began the famous intro to the song.

The big surprise of the night came when Bono flew onto the stage wearing a jetpack to sing the final verse of the song with Morrissey. He seized the microphone and waded into the crowd holding a spotlight from the stage, aiming it into the faces of the audience. "The Smiths were the f***ing truth. God bless you, Steven Patrick. God bless you, Johnny. Debt relief for Africa now!" The song continued for three minutes as Bono interjected lyrics from "Love Will Tear Us Apart", "Tangled Up In Blue", and "What's Goin' On".

The Smiths play Giants Stadium in New Jersey next week on the first stop of their "Make The World Listen Sponsored by MasterCard" stadium tour. After the awards ceremony, Marr sounded as enthusiastic as ever about the upcoming shows. "We've got a big, like, twenty million dollar stage set so people can really get the full Smiths experience", said Marr.

Responding to criticism about the ticket prices, which range from $175 to $885, Marr was defiant. "Nonsense. We're going to play a minimum of twenty-five songs during the set to make sure our fans get their money's worth. Morrissey will be tossing out six to seven Gucci shirts a night. Plus Green Day is opening for us".

 

[lainey]

You're really wrong on this one, Worm.
Marr has hardly ever said a single positive thing about Morrissey's solo career. The only exception is for 'The Last of the Famous International Playboys'.
Much of what he's said could be interpreted as snide comments. He doesn't listen to modern Moz songs coz he knows what they're gonna sound like. He doesn't listen to modern Moz coz it's not his kind of thing.
Who's the best vocalists Morrissey or Curtis? "Tricky one but I'd go for Curtis" (or words to that effect). Unbelievable!
Can you imagine Morrissey being asked who's the better guitarist, Marr or Edge, and him replying Edge? Of course you flipping couldn't!
Morrissey said that Marr hasn't been equalled. Morrissey dedicated his Ivor Novello to Marr (or at least thanked him specifically).
With the exception of a comment about an early Electronic song, Moz hasn't said anything unpleasant about post-Smiths Marr; quite the reverse (see the praise he gave Marr in the notorious NME immigration interview).
To say that Marr and Moz have been equally supportive/positive about each other in their post Smiths years is just nonsense.

I've felt the same over the years about Marr....

 

[Worm]

You're really wrong on this one, Worm.
Marr has hardly ever said a single positive thing about Morrissey's solo career. The only exception is for 'The Last of the Famous International Playboys'.
Much of what he's said could be interpreted as snide comments. He doesn't listen to modern Moz songs coz he knows what they're gonna sound like. He doesn't listen to modern Moz coz it's not his kind of thing.
Who's the best vocalists Morrissey or Curtis? "Tricky one but I'd go for Curtis" (or words to that effect). Unbelievable!
Can you imagine Morrissey being asked who's the better guitarist, Marr or Edge, and him replying Edge? Of course you flipping couldn't!
Morrissey said that Marr hasn't been equalled. Morrissey dedicated his Ivor Novello to Marr (or at least thanked him specifically).
With the exception of a comment about an early Electronic song, Moz hasn't said anything unpleasant about post-Smiths Marr; quite the reverse (see the praise he gave Marr in the notorious NME immigration interview).
To say that Marr and Moz have been equally supportive/positive about each other in their post Smiths years is just nonsense.

Over the years I've read as many interviews as anyone else here. My sincere opinion is that there's been plenty of kindness and bitchiness on both sides. I'm not arguing they're "equal", merely that nobody should expect Johnny Marr to make statements that Morrissey wouldn't make either.

Remember, I am not saying Johnny Marr has been 100% gracious to Morrissey in his public comments. I am responding to smiler's original assertion that Marr should come out and make some grand statement about how wonderful Morrissey is. He doesn't need to say anything more than he's said.

EDIT:

Regarding Bernard Sumner, here's something Johnny said about him:

While I'm most closely associated with Morrissey, Bernard and I finish each others' sentences (which is scary because I don't know what he's on about half the time).

We've only made three albums, but I've worked with him more closely, and for a longer period of time, than I've worked with anyone else. Our coming together was almost like finding a refuge from our earlier groups. With Electronic the friendship is more important than the music, which is unusual and a bit of a first for me.​

Bear that in mind whenever Johnny says something nice about a man who sounds like one of his very best friends.

As for Ian, I did a Google search and guess what? You posted this here a few years back. The actual words Johnny used to answer the question of his favorite vocalist were: "Ian Curtis, today". Emphasis mine. Now think back to what I quoted yesterday about Marr's mind changing on a daily basis. I agree it was mean to choose Ian over Morrissey but "today" certainly takes the edge off his comment. Consider also that Marr said he was a fan of Joy Division years before meeting Morrissey as well as his friendship with the band.

 

[smiler]

I spent a few minutes Googling Johnny Marr interviews earlier today, and I posted a few quotes. Can you do the same for this? I'm not trying to be a pest. I know of several statements he's made about Bernard Sumner (I don't deny he's made catty comments about Morrissey) but my sincere impression, from years of reading Johnny Marr interviews with great interest, is that these catty comments are few and far between-- and there are more than enough nice comments to balance them out.]

no i'm not finding quotes - trust me - plus others people on here say the same thing

I think you'll find that Morrissey doesn't give credit to Johnny very often. Nor does he talk fondly of his own older work, solo or Smiths. If I'm not mistaken, Morrissey called "You Are The Quarry" his best album ever. Then he said that about "Ringleaders". And again about "Years of Refusal". Neither of them spends much time talking up the past.]

he used to say it all the time before marr failed to reponsed as positively and then the court case happened - he gave up - he was also fighting with the Smiths shadow which is understandable however unlike marr he continued producing great work and now his and the Smiths shadows have merged

but the time for fighting with shadows has now passed - the dye has cast

Morrissey doesn't need johnny anymore he tours the world playing those songs and will go down in history even if he doesn't sing another word.

if johnny wants a reunion as i suspect, he needs to swallow his pride - my point is that wouldn't even be a big deal - just say the truth and be kind - Morrissey humbled himself for years and only gave up when all he got was snide.

I don't see any difference between the flip answers he gives and the ones Morrissey gives ("I'd sooner eat my own testicles").]

This was about The Smiths not marr nobody whats to see mike again

I can't prove you're wrong but I will say that I think your interpretation is a case of "reading between the lines" and mine is based on what Marr actually says. Why shouldn't we take Johnny at his word?]

we agree that what he says isn't true so he is either not telling the truth or he is delluded. I'm not sure which.

Yeah, but when can any artist evaluate his own work accurately? I don't expect Morrissey, Marr, or anyone else to agree with my assessment. Dan Brown probably thinks he's the greatest popular novelist since Dickens-- I disagree, but I wouldn't expect him to agree with me, let alone volunteer his agreement in print!]

so you think he is delluded then? fine - i reckon he is probabaly just not telling the truth due to pride

The reason I've focused on Marr's own definition of success is to argue that Marr does not feel any real need to play with Morrissey again, for a one-off gig or a couple of singles or whatever. I'm not saying Marr is right about his self-evaluation. I'm saying he may be telling the truth when he says he doesn't care about one more shot at "generation-defining greatness", as you put it. I really don't think he cares. He and Morrissey defined their generation twenty years ago. A generation defined once is defined forever. It's done. It's over with.]

the dumb answers he gives lead me to think he wants a reunion - and i believe both parties are still capable of great work - Morrissey definatley is.

Hey, I agree with you. It sounds ridiculous to me, too. I'm not really interested in rendering a judgment on whether or not he's correct, merely in what he believes is correct.]

so again you think he's delluded okay i get it

No. I don't need to hear him say it. We all know it. He knows it. As I said he doesn't want to overshadow his current bandmates. That's fair and understandable. I guarantee you that a day will come when Marr will make a grand and definitive statement of admiration, affection, and respect for Morrissey. I think Marr will be about, oh, 85 years old when that happens. But so what?]

because i think if marr sent Morrissey some music he couldn't resist and it could be great and also nice.

And also I have to quibble with your use of the word "constantly". He's talked up Bernard a few times, mostly in a lighthearted way. He hasn't "constantly" praised Bernard at Morrissey's expense.]

yes he does

By way of response, read this:

"My big memory of The Queen Is Dead," says Johnny Marr, "is being behind the mixing desk at about half 12 in the morning. We had all this elation going on, a real high, and it was, How about his on the verse, and this on the chorus? There was also some shit going on about us being out of our Rough Trade contract.

"Morrissey had been talking to a lawyer about it. This guy was the biggest clichéd textbook, we didn't like him at all. He called me up. It was a closed session, not easy to get through to us — but he managed it. He said, 'I'm working on this, Johnny, but we may be looking at an injunction on this record.' I'm a quarter of the way into climbing this mountain, and I've got this wanker telling me Rough Trade are going to injunct the record. I was like, (Sarcastically) Great, fantastic.

"Then the phone went about three-quarters of an hour later, and it was this guy Jay from Rough Trade — who was a sweet guy — to tell me that Salford Van Hire had been on to Rough Trade, and because our roadie had brought the van back two days later than we'd paid for, they were going to sue as well, and we needed a lawyer's address. I was like, Jay — f*** off. And I went back to climbing the mountain. That was the one of the first times I took a picture in my mind, and thought, This is insane."

- Mojo, April 2001​

This is why i yawned - so what - he still left - he could have took a break.

 

[PregnantForTheLastTime]

Rolling Stone - September 2011 - Reporting From Cleveland

The Smiths were enshrined into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in high style Saturday night...

and

Thank God, we're safe. I saw the nominations for this year and The Smiths are again not on the list. This is as it should be.

 

[death below the stairs]

I agree, that The Smiths should never ever get back together. That would be awful.
For a start The Smiths were an artistic and powerful statement. To meddle with that now would be silly. Morrissey knows that, that is why he has turned down lots of money.
But I would love to see Morrissey and Marr together again. I get the impression Marr is a bit of a snake though, he likes to be all things to all people.
I remember Noel saying years ago, that Marr said "take my advice wright your own lyrics"- or words to that affect. He moans about Some Girls are Bigger than others. saying he came up with a sublime piece of music only for Morrissey to ruin it- I love that song!!!
I sometimes think deep down Marr would have rather been in a band like Oasis or The Stone Roses- he used to hang out with the Rose's (well had a few parties with them at least). What I mean by that is although he is proud of being in an important band, I think he would rather it have been a more laddish band.

If Moz and Marr do team up once more I hope they carry on the idea they were going to use after Strangeways. Marr said it was going to be a Scott Walker ballad type of thing. That would be wonderful and Morrisseys Voice is just at the correct stage to really make it work,

 

[Amy]

Moz/Marr openly praising each other would only encourage yet more inane reunion speculation amongst the fans and in the Press - something I would guess that both of them are sick to the back f***ing teeth of hearing.

And right on cue -

http://breakingnews.iol.ie/entertainment/marr-fuels-smiths-reform-rumours-427338.html

 

[smiler]

Rolling Stone - September 2011 - Reporting From Cleveland

The Smiths were enshrined into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in high style Saturday night. Appearing onstage together for the first time in 24 years, Morrissey and Johnny Marr electrified the crowd with an acceptance speech that was humorous and emotional in equal measure.

"I'd be a corpse rotting in the bowels of a library somewhere in Manchester if he hadn't knocked on my door", said Morrissey, visibly fighting tears.

"Morrissey, we were equal partners, but I have to say, in your words, the pleasure and the privilege were mine", Marr answered.

At the conclusion of the speech, Morrissey and Marr were joined by former bassist Andy Rourke and drummer Zak Starkey (filling in for an absent Mike Joyce) for a rousing mini-set of Smiths classics.

Surprise guest stars poured from the wings to jam with the legends from Manchester who many consider the best band of the Eighties.

Carlos Santana played a rousing six-minute solo during "Shoplifters Of The World Unite". Elton John played piano on "A Rush And A Push And The Land Is Ours". Tom Petty added some acoustic guitar while Johnny Marr sang a rowdy version of "Asleep", with Morrissey sporting a quizzical look as he banged a tambourine from the side of the stage.

Bruce Springsteen paid tribute to The Smiths before "This Charming Man". "I didn't even know where Manchester was on a map before The Smiths came along. That's the power of rock and roll, man".

Coldplay's Christ Martin was even more emphatic. Pointing to Morrissey, Martin simply shook his head and said, "This guy. This guy. This guy is the reason".

The highlight of the set was a blistering, heart-breaking rendition of "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out". Morrissey introduced the song by giving out the web address to the iTunes Store for a free download. "Please go and download a free live track from iTunes.com, and thanks to Apple for sponsoring this year's show", the graying singer intoned before Phil Collins, guesting on sticks, began the famous intro to the song.

The big surprise of the night came when Bono flew onto the stage wearing a jetpack to sing the final verse of the song with Morrissey. He seized the microphone and waded into the crowd holding a spotlight from the stage, aiming it into the faces of the audience. "The Smiths were the f***ing truth. God bless you, Steven Patrick. God bless you, Johnny. Debt relief for Africa now!" The song continued for three minutes as Bono interjected lyrics from "Love Will Tear Us Apart", "Tangled Up In Blue", and "What's Goin' On".

The Smiths play Giants Stadium in New Jersey next week on the first stop of their "Make The World Listen Sponsored by MasterCard" stadium tour. After the awards ceremony, Marr sounded as enthusiastic as ever about the upcoming shows. "We've got a big, like, twenty million dollar stage set so people can really get the full Smiths experience", said Marr.

Responding to criticism about the ticket prices, which range from $175 to $885, Marr was defiant. "Nonsense. We're going to play a minimum of twenty-five songs during the set to make sure our fans get their money's worth. Morrissey will be tossing out six to seven Gucci shirts a night. Plus Green Day is opening for us".

lol - that started off quite nice and then rapidly became horrid.

 

[Worm]

no i'm not finding quotes - trust me - plus others people on here say the same thing

Okay, well, I've tried to back up my arguments with quotes.

Some people here might be able to pull up quotes by Marr which insult Morrissey in some way.

Nobody is going to dig up any quotes which reveal Johnny to be a proud man who secretly wants to reunite The Smiths but can't say the words. All the evidence is to the contrary.

he used to say it all the time

No, he didn't.

Morrissey humbled himself for years and only gave up when all he got was snide.

Untrue. And being Morrissey fans, do I have to remind you that the story we get from the press-- which is our only window into their relationship-- is unreliable? Press coverage of The Smiths as well as their feud has been repeatedly described by both men as false.

You're making a soap opera out of the barest shreds of evidence.

so again you think he's delluded okay i get it

No. I don't think Johnny Marr is deluded. I think Marr defines success as being half of one of the greatest songwriting duos in the history of pop music (check), making music that gratifies his ever-changing tastes (check), playing with friends (check), making lots of money (check), and leading a positive, forward-looking life that doesn't involve revisiting the past for the enjoyment of tens of thousands of strangers who will always resent him for breaking up The Smiths anyway (check).

Not only do I think Marr doesn't care about a Smiths reunion, I think he's probably the healthiest-minded famous musician I've ever seen or read about. He says he wants to live in the present and not the past. Why is that so difficult to believe?

And before anyone else jumps in and accuses me of parroting the usual line about Marr being a saint and Morrissey being the megalomaniac jerk, let me add that I think, with regard to The Smiths, Morrissey has said and done all the right things, too. I give them both enormous credit for their public remarks about the band and any possible reunions. It is my hope that they never change course. There are many more Morrissey solo albums I'm looking forward to buying, and many more Modest Cribs albums I'm looking forward to missing. The world spins on happily.

This is why i yawned - so what - he still left - he could have took a break.

No. He could not have taken a break. He could not have taken a break because there was a permanent, in-built wrench in the gears and its name was Morrissey. Personally I don't know if the accounts of The Smiths are true or not-- see my comment above about the press-- but from what I've read The Smiths were breaking down because they didn't have proper management, and it has been strongly suggested that in the eyes of Johnny Marr proper management was impossible because of Morrissey.

 

[Worm]

that started off quite nice and then rapidly became horrid.

You've just described the history of 99% of the bands that ever existed.

 

[smiler]

Okay, well, I've tried to back up my arguments with quotes..

you seem to like to argue - if you look hard enough you'll find quotes if you want them, their are too many to find/mention - lots of people on this thread remember them.

Nobody is going to dig up any quotes which reveal Johnny to be a proud man who secretly wants to reunite The Smiths but can't say the words. All the evidence is to the contrary..

evidence? give over - you are being silly if he can't say the words there will be no quotes

No, he didn't.

yes he did lol

You're making a soap opera out of the barest shreds of evidence.

you're making a soap opera - i am keeping it simple

No. I don't think Johnny Marr is deluded.

you think he sincerley hold a belief that is incorrect - deluded

I think Marr defines success as being half of one of the greatest songwriting duos in the history of pop music (check), making music that gratifies his ever-changing tastes (check), playing with friends (check), making lots of money (check), and leading a positive, forward-looking life that doesn't involve revisiting the past for the enjoyment of tens of thousands of strangers who will always resent him for breaking up The Smiths anyway (check)..

fair enough then we disagree - (but you are wrong)

Not only do I think Marr doesn't care about a Smiths reunion, I think he's probably the healthiest-minded famous musician I've ever seen or read about. He says he wants to live in the present and not the past. Why is that so difficult to believe? .

again - because he gives such lame answers - too many to find/mention

No. He could not have taken a break. He could not have taken a break because there was a permanent, in-built wrench in the gears and its name was Morrissey. Personally I don't know if the accounts of The Smiths are true or not-- see my comment above about the press-- but from what I've read The Smiths were breaking down because they didn't have proper management, and it has been strongly suggested that in the eyes of Johnny Marr proper management was impossible because of Morrissey.

yawn - you do seem a little anti-morrissey "a built-in wrench"? get you! yeah i've read those books too - didn't believe most of them - he could have taken a break. their was no gun to his head - even if he had to leave he could have been nicer about it.

 

[Danny_]

One thing people forget is that Johnny announced that he was leaving the band when he was actually on a break, when there were no gigs booked, no requirement for him to do any promotional work (that was Morrissey's job), and he was actually sunning himself in LA.

Also, all the time he complains he was being overworked and being asked to do too much, he was actually moonlighting playing on various other people's records.

That never makes much sense to me.

 

[Worm]

you seem to like to argue - if you look hard enough you'll find quotes if you want them, their are too many to find/mention - lots of people on this thread remember them.

evidence? give over - you are being silly if he can't say the words there will be no quotes

yeah i've read those books too - didn't believe most of them

you're making a soap opera - i am keeping it simple

In other words, the evidence that does exist you discount. The evidence that does not exist you make up to suit your version of events.

Wouldn't "keeping it simple" mean taking Johnny Marr's words at face value?

yawn - you do seem a little anti-morrissey "a built-in wrench"? get you! - he could have taken a break. their was no gun to his head - even if he had to leave he could have been nicer about it.

I could argue against this but you'd probably dismiss as lies the magazine articles, video clips, and books I could cite.

I'm not "anti-Morrissey". I've spoken up in Morrissey's defense many times (and in fact made a point of praising Morrissey in my last post). I have hardly gushed about Marr's post-Smiths work. I am simply speaking up for Johnny Marr whom I hold in high esteem thanks to his partnership with Morrissey.

We've reached a point of diminishing returns. That's okay. That's where all these threads end up anyway. Fun all the same.

I'll close by bringing it back around to the subject of this thread. If Morrissey and Marr are pals again, does it make sense to be indignant about Marr's public slights against Morrissey, when Morrissey himself is apparently over it?

 

[smiler]

crumbs worm!

In other words, the evidence that does exist you discount. The evidence that does not exist you make up to suit your version of events.

the evidence does exist other posters on this thread are saying the same things - haven't you noticed? - nobody seems to agree with you - and i just have other stuff to do

Wouldn't "keeping it simple" mean taking Johnny Marr's words at face value?

i'd be happy too take johnny's word if his answers on the subject weren't so lame and transparent

I could argue against this but you'd probably dismiss as lies the magazine articles, video clips, and books I could cite.?

hardly fair

We've reached a point of diminishing returns. That's okay. That's where all these threads end up anyway. Fun all the same. ?

agreed

I'll close by bringing it back around to the subject of this thread. If Morrissey and Marr are pals again, does it make sense to be indignant about Marr's public slights against Morrissey, when Morrissey himself is apparently over it?

Morrissey will only be over it when johnny starts to tell the truth

 

[Worm]

Morrissey will only be over it when johnny starts to tell the truth

Is this tongue in cheek?

First you claim that Johnny Marr's statements to the press can be discounted as "transparently" untrue. Now you're saying you know how Morrissey feels about Johnny Marr. Either you're a mind reader or I'm talking to a member of Morrissey's inner circle. Which is it?

I think my question was pretty straightforward. Tell me if it's not. I'll ask again: if Marr and Morrissey are in contact with each other in a cordial way-- even if only by email-- isn't that proof that Morrissey is over it?

Because it seems to me that if Morrissey is friendly with Johnny Marr, then the only one holding a grudge here is you.