Shirley Manson (Garbage) Attacks Morrissey For Defending K.Spacey & H.Weinstein - Alternative Nation

Iconic 90’s Rock Singer Attacks Morrissey For Defending Kevin Spacey & Harvey Weinstein - Alternative Nation
By Brett Buchanan - Nov 19, 2017.

Excerpt:

"Garbage frontwoman Shirley Manson has reacted to former Smiths frontman Morrissey defending Kevin Spacey and Harvey Weinstein following the sexual assault allegations against the two Hollywood titans.

Manson tweeted, “Morrissey has lost the f***ing plot. Weinstein + Spacey unfairly attacked? For rape, sexual abuse+coercion etc. f*** U Morrissey! f*** YOU.”"



Regards,
FWD

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BrummieBoy said:
SPIEGEL: Since we're in Hollywood, have you followed the debates about Harvey Weinstein , Kevin Spacey and #MeToo ?

Morrissey: All at once everyone is guilty. Anyone who has ever said to someone else, "I like you," is suddenly being charged with sexual harassment. You have to put these things in the right relations. If I can not tell anyone that I like him, how should he ever know?....Of course, there are extreme cases, rape is disgusting, every physical attack is repulsive. But we have to see it in relative terms. Otherwise, every person on this planet is guilty. We can not permanently decide from above what we are allowed to do and what we can not do. Because then we are all trapped. Some people are very awkward when it comes to romance anyway. They do not know what to do and then their behavior is aggressive.

Morrissey is trivialising sexual predation that doesn't lead to violent physical rape. His disgust at violent rape is used only to try and defuse the allegations against Weinstein and Spacey. He also seems to be suggesting that his own romantic clumsiness could potentially open him up to harassment charges. If he really thinks saying (or singing!) 'I Like You' is in any way similar to the behaviour alleged against Weinstein and Spacey, he needs counselling. However, even in this warped view of things, romantic ineptitude isn't a reason to absolve someone if 'their behaviour is aggressive'.

He also appears deeply confused about the purpose of legal restrictions on sexual behaviour when he claims 'we can not permanently decide from above what we are allowed to do and what we can not do'. Society explicitly mandates this through legal restrictions on sexual behaviour. Why is Morrissey railing against the ongoing evolution of a legal code of sexual decency in society? On what basis did he then complain of sexual assault at LAX airport by a TSA security guard? If he demands a zero tolerance of sexual assault in his life whilst he travels to/from his gigs, why does he have issues with others who have complained of sexual assault by Spacey and Weinstein whilst in employment-related environments? The hypocrisy is staggering.
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Sterling work you're doing, Brummie. I've defended Morrissey for years, find some excuse, but this is just too much. Really, it should've been too much years ago.

Morrissey's levels of hypocrisy on many subjects is tragic.

Meat is murder, made lots of money and earned recognition as being someone who stands up for animals - wears an overpriced Alexander McQueen cardigan made from the hair of animals.

Migrants are diluting Englishness; migrants have led to a rise in rape - he says this while criticising Trump, who said the same things about Mexicans and rise in rape and criminal activity. Morrissey himself is the son of Irish immigrants, who were once seen as a threat to the English way of life.

Wrote songs about the harm of minors by adults with power (Suffer Little Children, Children in Pieces, The Headmaster Ritual), once proclaimed himself as a feminist, and complained he was sexually assaulted at an airport - normalises sexual harrassment that doesn't lead to violent sexual acts and/or rape.

Brexit was a good thing, chosen by the British people; Germany should stay 'German' - he says this while having residencies in multiple countries, and having the freedom to choose to go to whatever nation he wishes.
 
Quando quando quando said:
A goddess that can’t read and ignores his very clear, strict and explicit statement only wants to read in it what she wants to read in it and is no goddess by any account.
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Morrissey saying that was the same as when people say "I'm not racist, but...". They make a positive statement in an attempt to negate the horrible thing they are about to say.
 
Anonymous said:
So, everyone on this board now knows you’re a liar. This was never said and you know it. Argue your point but let’s at least be truthful.
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He may not have said that ALL Mexicans are rapists, but he implied that most Mexican migrants are criminals, drug dealers and rapists.

“When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.”

–Donald Trump, presidential announcement speech, June 16, 2015
 
Anonymous said:
Morrissey saying that was the same as when people say "I'm not racist, but...". They make a positive statement in an attempt to negate the horrible thing they are about to say.
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Okay, so they can’t say “I am not racist, but....”
They can’t say “I am racist, but...”
They should all shut up. Fine.
You think it should all stay in the not public domain at home and bars?

The domain of what everybody says in private? Do you think it would solve any issue about racism? I fear not.
It will go underground and suddenly explode. At least that happened in past history on more occasion than one.

Morrissey is more for free speech than anyone who wants to ban opinions they don’t like.

They do exist you know.
By the way how are you going to make your point in discussions if you want to shut people up and they do? For fear of being called racist if they think they’re not?

The things he said were realistic.
Not defending Weinstein or Spacey but pointing out that there is another side to it. A side to human behaviour that also exists but what many people don’t want to see cause it might be hurtful to the real victims. It sure can. But that is why he made the other statement that is there, ignored for whatever reasons.
 
Quando quando quando said:
Okay, so they can’t say “I am not racist, but....”
They can’t say “I am racist, but...”
They should all shut up. Fine.
You think it should all stay in the not public domain at home and bars?

The domain of what everybody says in private? Do you think it would solve any issue about racism? I fear not.
It will go underground and suddenly explode. At least that happened in past history on more occasion than one.

Morrissey is more for free speech than anyone who wants to ban opinions they don’t like.

They do exist you know.
By the way how are you going to make your point in discussions if you want to shut people up and they do? For fear of being called racist if they think they’re not?

The things he said were realistic.
Not defending Weinstein or Spacey but pointing out that there is another side to it. A side to human behaviour that also exists but what many people don’t want to see cause it might be hurtful to the real victims. It sure can. But that is why he made the other statement that is there, ignored for whatever reasons.
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As I've said to other people with right-wing views when they say "free speech" - no one is saying you can't speak freely, no one. But the right to free speech comes with the right of others to deconstruct and criticise your opinions, particularly when you try to normalise disgusting behaviour and victim shame (as Morrissey has done), and make unsubstantial claims about migrants (as Morrissey has done).
 
Firstly, I wish to say that all sexual harrassment is a serious matter and should be dealt with in a thorough and sensitive way. However, I can understand why it is so apparently prevalent in a working environment. Work is not a natural environment. It is often a stressful and alienating place where people have to adopt roles that don't come naturally. I know I certainly behave in a more aggressive manner at work because, quite frankly, I would sink in the current economic climate where there are a dozen people ready to fill your shoes if ever spiralling targets aren't met. When you are racing through the day at top speed sometimes it's inevitable that your mouth will engage before your brain does or you'll act out of character. Work can allso be a lonely place where all you want to do is get home to a loved one and be comforted. Add to this the whole macho thing of not showing weakness or vulnerability and stifling your emotions and you have an environment ripe for sexual harrassment. I say this as a gay man but even I feel the pressure of my male peers (and, yes, my female peers) not to 'wimp out' and ' act like a man'. It' a very confusing time to be a man.
 
Anonymous said:
So, everyone on this board now knows you’re a liar. This was never said and you know it. Argue your point but let’s at least be truthful.
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Ok, in all fairness, this is what Trump said. I believe it is in the spirit of what Morrissey believes in his statement about Berlin being the "capital of rape" because of immigration:

-- "When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending their best. ... They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people," Trump said in his announcement speech. June 2015.
 
Sister I'm a Poet said:
Ok, in all fairness, this is what Trump said. I believe it is in the spirit of what Morrissey believes in his statement about Berlin being the "capital of rape" because of immigration:

-- "When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending their best. ... They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people," Trump said in his announcement speech. June 2015.
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You're trying to justify his comments by equating them with Trump's.

Right.
 
Anonymous said:
What about Walt Whitman's 'victims'? He liked a boy or two as well by all accounts...Cos all 'children' are victims aren't they and all 'adults' are abusers?
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Interesting. I have heard compelling arguments about Whitman's homosexuality, but not any accounts of his relations with minors. Do share.

And, yes, adults shouldn't be be having sex with minors. I don't think that that is a radical position. It has been argued that sex between a minor and an adult can never be considered completely consensual because of the power dynamic. Do you think adults should be able to have sex with "consenting" minors?
 
Anonymous said:
Should we 'side' with either side? What about 'siding' with truth and common sense?
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Ok, common sense says that when dozens of victims come forward independently of each with similar stories of abuse that the truth probably lies with the accusers and not the accused. Just sayin'
 
Quando quando quando said:
A goddess that can’t read and ignores his very clear, strict and explicit statement only wants to read in it what she wants to read in it and is no goddess by any account.
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I will and always will be a darkling at heart. Shirley Manson is an intelligent woman and even listed The smiths as one of Garbages influences. As a female musician ,I am a female musician, I can't overlook her. I do love Morrissey but his statement was a bit much for me. When someone tells you they've been abused, you do not victimize them again by saying they're lying, seen it happen to people before, it f***ing hurts .Not that I plan on giving up on him, t's just interesting to watch two of my musical heroes have a fall out.
 
Pixie_pill_popper said:
I will and always will be a darkling at heart. Shirley Manson is an intelligent woman and even listed The smiths as one of Garbages influences. As a female musician ,I am a female musician, I can't overlook her. I do love Morrissey but his statement was a bit much for me. When someone tells you they've been abused, you do not victimize them again by saying they're lying, seen it happen to people before, it f***ing hurts .Not that I plan on giving up on him, t's just interesting to watch two of my musical heroes have a fall out.
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You cant just believe everyone point blank either. Harvey Weinstein has a billion accusers and settlements and morrisseys comments shouldn’t apply to spacey who’s victims was a minor and can’t consent no matter what but imagine if people just took Conor obersts accusers at face value. People do make up things for whatever reason from racist attacks to sexual harassment. There was an article not long ago at ny mag about a woman who objected to a dad in a family changin room. When he said he wouldn’t leave she threatened to tell a security guard that he was leering at her children. If another mom hadn’t spoken up for him he could have had his life. No one wants to disbelieve a victim but no one should want to enable a phoney accuser and they do exist. Shirley Manson is great though. I love garbage and have seen her perform
 
Sister I'm a Poet said:
Ok, in all fairness, this is what Trump said. I believe it is in the spirit of what Morrissey believes in his statement about Berlin being the "capital of rape" because of immigration:

-- "When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending their best. ... They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people," Trump said in his announcement speech. June 2015.
Click to expand...
As the original poster that you replied to I just wanted to give you props for acknowledging and posting the actual quote. Believe wat you will but at least now we’re starting from a place of truth. Best wishes to you.
 
Anonymous said:
Sterling work you're doing, Brummie.
Meat is murder, made lots of money and earned recognition as being someone who stands up for animals - wears an overpriced Alexander McQueen cardigan made from the hair of animals.

Migrants are diluting Englishness; migrants have led to a rise in rape - he says this while criticising Trump, who said the same things about Mexicans and rise in rape and criminal activity. Morrissey himself is the son of Irish immigrants, who were once seen as a threat to the English way of life.

Wrote songs about the harm of minors by adults with power (Suffer Little Children, Children in Pieces, The Headmaster Ritual), once proclaimed himself as a feminist, and complained he was sexually assaulted at an airport - normalises sexual harrassment that doesn't lead to violent sexual acts and/or rape.

Brexit was a good thing, chosen by the British people; Germany should stay 'German' - he says this while having residencies in multiple countries, and having the freedom to choose to go to whatever nation he wishes.
Click to expand...

as Brummieboy has said... 'receipt?'
 
Hope so and I hope Tom Callahan @Tom_Shotz is sued for defamation by my hero (who has rescued me in so many ways, LOL.)

My 2 cents re: abuse victims. These desperate Hollywood starlets failed to blow the whistle at the time of the alleged abuse when the evidence was fresh because they were prostitutes who would do anything to get in the movies. "Scared to show intelligence? It might smear your lovely career." But when someone else complains they jump in saying "me too" because now they're really gonna be in the spotlights. Pathetic.

iHeartMoz
:love:

p.s. Shirley Manson, you stupid garbage-head; you get no condolences from me on the loss of your father.

Surface said:
Some thick twats there, looks like some of them have had their posts reported.
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