"The years have proved the only thing Morrissey understood was himself" - New Statesman

The years have proved the only thing Morrissey understood was himself - New Statesman
By Michael Hann

"The Smiths singer's comments on the Manchester attack are merely the latest example of his failure to grow up."

 

[Anonymous]

My one point of contention with the article is that in Bengali in Platforms, Morrissey wasn't making the argument that immigrants shouldn't belong in the UK. Instead, Morrissey was making the case that immigrants are dually tasked with the grudgeries of everyday life and compounded with the undertaking of cultural assimilation.

This is exactly how I've always interpreted this song, yet people always cite it as 1/3 examples of Morrissey's racism. It is frustrating to no end.

 

[bhops]

Hilarious. Three replies, and not one of them mention Morrissey.

Let me tell you the basic principle here. Racists can stand in the street, proclaim their hatred, and they will be arrested, because there are laws against such things. I can go out on the street and proclaim compassion and humanity, and I will not be arrested. The law is on MY side, not that of the racists. Deal with it.

And on the point of Morrissey, I found very little in that article to disagree with, especially the third last and second last paragraphs.

I don't know about that. Muslim hate preachers seem able to stand on the street spewing their vile sentiments while the police do nowt.

 

[Anonymous]

Morrissey is a conscientious person with interesting comments, but Michael Hann just talks poop. I don't even know who this Hann fool is, but I'll keep listening to Morrissey because he's so right on.

Go Moz, Go!

So, NPR has made reference about this attack being aimed at girls. But as a Moz fan I can't help notice that it was made in his hometown, on his birthday. at the concert of another vegan singer. She's female, but she sings about being a "Dangerous Woman." Well, it's just weird.

https://www.peta.org/blog/ariana-grande-goes-vegan/

Shite on this man. Morrissey is dead on the money this time.

 

[bhops]

And still. no other mentions of Morrissey. The racists, islamophobes and right-wing bells are out in force. This is how it's going to be, is it? No mention of the salient point but post after post after post of racist scaremongering bullshit?

What has race got to do with Islam?

 

[countthree]

Women who want to leave can find safe refuge and some do. Some believe in and accepts Islamic religious rules making it not a crime. A secular man might say I don want my wife going out in public without me and it up to her to decide if she wants that or not. She can leave and if she's not allowed to leave, say barred by force, she can run away and find help from authorities. In any of these cases, like in domestic violence cases, you need evidence of force be it physical or coercion to convict of a crime. Witnesses, in the cases you've raised the women, who will testify. It's like being raised in an Amish culture in a lot of ways. Either way demonizing a religion that the women still has a lot of ties to doesn't really help the situation if you're looking for solution sorry ways to help. she may just feel stuck between aspects of her religion she doesn't agree with and a public she feels will make it hard for her to survive if not be outright hostile to her. Kind of how a gay 18yo might have felt if raised in a violent Christian home not long ago. If you want to help these women, those who want to leave but can't due to violence volunteer at a women home instead of inspiring hate towards her on the internet and hate towards her religion as a whole

Even when you were born into an occidental society under non islamic culture, it is very difficult to escape from domestic violence. Too many women die or live under a system of daily abuse for allowing you to say such a stupid and naive commentary. Did you read Big Little Lies or watch the TV series? That is what happens with domestic violence. It's very difficult to escape from it. Alive. Imagine how difficult it must be when you were born and raised into an islamic environment.
If you live under such rules it is not "up to you" as a woman to decide if you go out if your husband don't want you to do that. Can you imagine an islamic woman leaving her home with her 5 or 6 children looking for help from the authorities? If those authorities don't help people who live in the streets, why do you think they will help her and her children when she can be returned to her husband and put the problem out of sight?
Of course you need evidence to prove any crime. In domestic violence crimes evidence is very difficult to achieve, because abuses are comitted into the house of the perpetrators in a domestic environment. A veil doesn't help to notice bruises and injuries. Psychological violence is even harder to prove, but it's easier to understand that the only act of putting a woman under a segregating culture from her birth makes her a victim as soon as she reaches the age of five. I am not the one inspiring hate here, thinking is not an act of hate. Bombing is. Slavement is. Don't caring about sufferers is. Ignorance is.

 

[Anonymous]

Maybe all immigrants should be required to draw a caricature of the prophet Muhammad as part 1 of an application process. Having said that...I fall on the tolerant side...and only seek tolerance of and from those that wish to join me. I also am not naive enough to think that Western Governments are innocent....the scales are heavily imbalanced. I am also not naive enough to think that western cultures have no guilt in the molding of these second generation killers...that doesnt justify what they do....but life is much more difficult when you don't "belong" and that has consequences. Trump, Farange, Le Pen, et al. would have you believe that immigrants are the cause for all the ills in your life. That the solution, is to attack them, ban then, shun them, ignore them, and steal from them while the whole time supporting the ones that enslave them.

 

[Bluebirds]

Getting fed up of the liberal cognescenti demeaning of anyone who dares speak a different truth. It's borderline censorship and does the debate no favours.

Whilst I disagree with what Morrissey said many people actually think his opinion, borderline racist as it may be, is a truer reflection of their ire and anger at this situation than the way most of the mainstream media are reporting it. People, rightly or wrongly, are getting more and more agitated about the whole fundamental Islam situation.

I advise you to watch the Tony Bellew (he's a Scouse boxer and movie star) which I have seen posted many times by friends of mine where he pulls no punches and is probably a more accurate reflection of how many 'working-class' people are feeling at this moment in time

 

[Herpes Harmonica]

Getting fed up of the liberal cognescenti demeaning of anyone who dares speak a different truth. It's borderline censorship and does the debate no favours.

Whilst I disagree with what Morrissey said many people actually think his opinion, borderline racist as it may be, is a truer reflection of their ire and anger at this situation than the way most of the mainstream media are reporting it. People, rightly or wrongly, are getting more and more agitated about the whole fundamental Islam situation.

I advise you to watch the Tony Bellew (he's a Scouse boxer and movie star) which I have seen posted many times by friends of mine where he pulls no punches and is probably a more accurate reflection of how many 'working-class' people are feeling at this moment in time

I feel we have a problem with the silent majority muslims who could do more and should do more. People have a right to be angry and anger comes from fear but any boxer knows anger wins no fights. When angry you become incredibly stupid and the only good thing from it is that adrenaline makes you feel less pain for a while.

I believe living with anger causes health issues and I have a feeling Manchester is the start of a new approach to tackle extremism of any kind. There is this notion that there will be a war and one side will win but no one wins in a war. It is just a way of pushing the problems into the future.

The problem for the majority of the muslims that also hate terror is that they too are afraid. They more than anyone live close to these terrorists. That is an issue that we have to deal with.

 

[Anonymous]

Even when you were born into an occidental society under non islamic culture, it is very difficult to escape from domestic violence. Too many women die or live under a system of daily abuse for allowing you to say such a stupid and naive commentary. Did you read Big Little Lies or watch the TV series? That is what happens with domestic violence. It's very difficult to escape from it. Alive. Imagine how difficult it must be when you were born and raised into an islamic environment.
If you live under such rules it is not "up to you" as a woman to decide if you go out if your husband don't want you to do that. Can you imagine an islamic woman leaving her home with her 5 or 6 children looking for help from the authorities? If those authorities don't help people who live in the streets, why do you think they will help her and her children when she can be returned to her husband and put the problem out of sight?
Of course you need evidence to prove any crime. In domestic violence crimes evidence is very difficult to achieve, because abuses are comitted into the house of the perpetrators in a domestic environment. A veil doesn't help to notice bruises and injuries. Psychological violence is even harder to prove, but it's easier to understand that the only act of putting a woman under a segregating culture from her birth makes her a victim as soon as she reaches the age of five. I am not the one inspiring hate here, thinking is not an act of hate. Bombing is. Slavement is. Don't caring about sufferers is. Ignorance is.

No I didn't watch it but I have spent even a little time volenteering at a women's shelter and yes people leave even with kids. My own family has experience with domestic violence as my grandmother left with her four children escPing my physically abusive grandfather even as all her catholic resources said she needed to stay and not get divorced which would be a sin. She even got notice in the mail that her children were now considered bastards. You're all over the place though and I'm remembering quickly how roaming your conversation gets. I also don't think any one side is being more demeaning than anyone else as evidenced by the many examples even here. There is no working class opinion and there is no upper middle class opinion as they all have a mix of opinions. I despair the ide that being working class or poor is somehow more honest. From personal experience I see no magic or specialness to it nor does it make any opinion matter more or less

 

[Quando quando quando]

"...the culprit was born in Manchester of immigrant parents, just like Morrissey."

Yes, they were clearly the same. Are you f***ing kidding me? What a load of crap.

^^ This ^^
Suggestive and you almost start wondering if they were "the same", why Moz didn't become a suicide terrorist? What is wrong with him? Almost. Not, what is wrong with that murderer. Just an incident.

There were not many "ists" left they haven't accused him of yet.
There is still time for that of course while in the meantime we await the next atrocity.

But luckily there is Moz and by focusing on anything he says the attention to the fact there is a religious or ideological background can be sidetracked.
I'm waiting for the lunatics starting to blame Morrissey and accusing him to be responsible for it.

This article was a very damning piece of shit.
The only thing noteworthy though being the headline Morrissey only understanding himself.
Well, in my view you can only understand others if you first understand yourself.

 

[Herpes Harmonica]

"...the culprit was born in Manchester of immigrant parents, just like Morrissey."

Yes, they were clearly the same. Are you f***ing kidding me? What a load of crap.

This shows the passing of time and how things change. Morrissey was questioned by the police for his anti-Maggie song back in the day and now we have well known terrorists who travel back and forth to a war like it was some kind of resort and they go about life as if nothing has happened.

The problem is that they have to do something before the authorities can act and here in Sweden they cannot provoke criminals into criminal activities so they can arrest them cause that is against the law. This leaves us with a very difficult situation where everything is on a knife edge.

 

[Cornflakes]

Getting fed up of the liberal cognescenti demeaning of anyone who dares speak a different truth. It's borderline censorship and does the debate no favours.

Whilst I disagree with what Morrissey said many people actually think his opinion, borderline racist as it may be, is a truer reflection of their ire and anger at this situation than the way most of the mainstream media are reporting it. People, rightly or wrongly, are getting more and more agitated about the whole fundamental Islam situation.

I advise you to watch the Tony Bellew (he's a Scouse boxer and movie star) which I have seen posted many times by friends of mine where he pulls no punches and is probably a more accurate reflection of how many 'working-class' people are feeling at this moment in time

He briefly expresses what I would call a naive view of Vladimir Putin. But he's a boxer and its forgivable for him not to be an expert on Russian politics. And I personally don't support capital punishment. But it's not the end of the world for people to disagree about that, which he sort of acknowledges in the clip.

Apart from that, there's nothing at all offensive about what he says. Certain things are spot on. It's a huge mistake to be putting terrorists in with the general prison population, for example.

What he doesn't do anywhere in that clip is use the bombing as a chance to sow social division. He doesn't express anything that could be considered racist. He also isn't arrogantly dragging his own unrelated pet peeves into the discussion. Maybe he hates the Queen, but he's instinctively got more respect than to bring it up in that particular conversation.

 

[marred]

And still. no other mentions of Morrissey. The racists, islamophobes and right-wing bells are out in force. This is how it's going to be, is it? No mention of the salient point but post after post after post of racist scaremongering bullshit?

Islam is bullshit. I must be islamaphobic. But then again I have a fear of bullshit and it's a healthy one.

You sir are full of it.

 

[Anonymous]

^^ This ^^
Suggestive and you almost start wondering if they were "the same", why Moz didn't become a suicide terrorist? What is wrong with him? Almost. Not, what is wrong with that murderer. Just an incident.

There were not many "ists" left they haven't accused him of yet.
There is still time for that of course while in the meantime we await the next atrocity.

But luckily there is Moz and by focusing on anything he says the attention to the fact there is a religious or ideological background can be sidetracked.
I'm waiting for the lunatics starting to blame Morrissey and accusing him to be responsible for it.

This article was a very damning piece of shit.
The only thing noteworthy though being the headline Morrissey only understanding himself.
Well, in my view you can only understand others if you first understand yourself.

I don't think that's quite the point he was trying to get across, Morrissey would like closed borders, he doesn't like England mixing, nevermind terrorist he has been speaking like this for a long time. yet considering he was born in England to Irish parents, he doesn't seem to hold himself as part of it, one rule for him and another for others.

 

[Anonymous]

He briefly expresses what I would call a naive view of Vladimir Putin. But he's a boxer and its forgivable for him not to be an expert on Russian politics. And I personally don't support capital punishment. But it's not the end of the world for people to disagree about that, which he sort of acknowledges in the clip.

Apart from that, there's nothing at all offensive about what he says. Certain things are spot on. It's a huge mistake to be putting terrorists in with the general prison population, for example.

What he doesn't do anywhere in that clip is use the bombing as a chance to sow social division. He doesn't express anything that could be considered racist. He also isn't arrogantly dragging his own unrelated pet peeves into the discussion. Maybe he hates the Queen, but he's instinctively got more respect than to bring it up in that particular conversation.

Very much agree about the prison bit. It's already documented how many get recruited there

 

[marred]

Well, I happen to be on holiday in one of the chic, gay-friendly resorts in Southern Europe, and guess what - there are plenty of Muslim tourists here. I haven't been thrown off a roof, I'm rather enjoying myself, and my man too. I'm not scared that anyone will throw me off a roof back home in Sweden either.

That said, I am in record for saying - and you can look it up if you like - that I think Islam is a man-made belief system and ideology that isn't more worthy of protection than, say, fascism or Catholicism, and that the pussyfooting around Islam needs to stop. I just don't think that blatant racism, Trump and Putin are the answer.

Oh the old "It hasn't happened to me so everything must be good" rule of thumb.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

"The Smiths singer's comments on the Manchester attack are merely the latest example of his failure to grow up."

'The Smiths singer's' ? How does Hann expect M to 'grow up' in his eyes if he still sees him as singing for the Smiths?!

And with his piece, pulling out the old 'Bengali' standby and twisting the Norway comment and the 'subspecies' quote out of context to fit the agenda of his article, typical bullshit. I mean fine if he wants to use those as examples of being (in his opinion)harmful things to say, BUT, put it in context of WHY he said them and state how important the issue of animal cruelty is to him and how important it is to end the pointless death of animals for ignorant human consumption, which plays a large part in destroying our planet.

Violence breeds violence.

 

[Herpes Harmonica]

Oh the old "It hasn't happened to me so everything must be good" rule of thumb.

 

[marred]

Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder (OCD) is a common, chronic and long-lasting disorder in which a person has uncontrollable, reoccurring thoughts (obsessions) and behaviors (compulsions) that he or she feels the urge to repeat over and over;

• Can't control his or her thoughts or behaviors, even when those thoughts or behaviors are recognized as excessive
• Spends at least 1 hour a day on these thoughts or behaviors
• Doesn’t get pleasure when performing the behaviors or rituals, but may feel brief relief from the anxiety the thoughts cause
• Experiences significant problems in their daily life due to these thoughts or behaviors

I get your comparison but there's no need to bring a mental illness into the conversation in order to deride someone. It's possible to behave like this without having OCD. It's hard enough for people to live with a mental illness let alone being quoted as an example of a person less qualified to live life than the supposed sane ones.

Now if you want to talk about the mental illness that everyone seems to be climbing over each other to apologise for it's religion.

 

[countthree]

No I didn't watch it but I have spent even a little time volenteering at a women's shelter and yes people leave even with kids. My own family has experience with domestic violence as my grandmother left with her four children escPing my physically abusive grandfather even as all her catholic resources said she needed to stay and not get divorced which would be a sin. She even got notice in the mail that her children were now considered bastards. You're all over the place though and I'm remembering quickly how roaming your conversation gets. I also don't think any one side is being more demeaning than anyone else as evidenced by the many examples even here. There is no working class opinion and there is no upper middle class opinion as they all have a mix of opinions. I despair the ide that being working class or poor is somehow more honest. From personal experience I see no magic or specialness to it nor does it make any opinion matter more or less

It seems you were answering me, but I said nothing about working class or upper middle class, or poor people being more honest. I don't link honesty with classes or with money, it doesn't work that way. Sorry about the episodes of domestic violence in your family, but that doesn't mean you are more qualified than any other person to talk about it. There are social workers who operate in the area of domestic violence and try to help affected people.