Morrissey Central "Discredited." (June 25, 2023)

Discredited.

Discredited. - MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY - MORRISSEY CENTRAL - Discredited.

MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY on MORRISSEY CENTRAL

www.morrisseycentral.com

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[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

‘The truth’ is he’s got an exciting world tour coming up, starting next week, with exciting new members in the band, celebrating 40 years of great music. Is all that matters.

He couldn’t care less about Glastonbury and never did anyway.

Just because you’re invited to a party, it doesn’t mean you will actually go. But as you know, it’s nice getting the invitation.

So in that way, and with not getting positive feedback in the media regarding Rick’s tribute act, may also play a part in him feeling ‘discredited’.

But why would he write “discredited”

 

[It's me again]

I have lost all hope of wake-up calls. I don't know what happened behind the scenes but in the wake of Andy's passing (momentous in the Smiths camp surely) - I was at least hoping for an end to the sniping. All I see from Glasto is ... not poking the fire but no olive branches, no change. "You told me to shut up and get on with my own stuff, so that's what I'm doing", you know.

You look at those line-ups of Morrissey's old friends and you think.. how has he pushed away so many people? Johnny and Chrissie, who both meant the world to him, thick as thieves like the old days and he's left with Dodwell types - God, I'd be crying over that as well. Even things with Sparks went sour. But he won't take responsibility for his behaviour, he won't apologise for anything, one person speaks against him and they're next out of the door. God, we don't even have Alain any more. He is self-destructing one day at a time.

Agree with your general stance, but I don't see Chrissie/Johnny currently being close as an issue.

As far as I can tell, CH and Noel are the two people who remain close to Moz and Johnny, and probably the only two who could bring about a rapprochment. It wouldn't surprise me if either now act as unofficial emissary. I'd have thought CH is the one person he'd take a talking to from.

Wouldn't be surprised if she shows up at one of the UK shows to introduce him, like Brixton about 10 years ago.

 

[Rufusindigo]

I ageee, especially on the neurodiversity angle. Problem is, he needs kind advisers, rather than SER/Fiona hangers-on. And he won't be told, even when it's clearly in his best interest. So there's little chance of those kind advisers materialising.

Yes, I know it's pure speculation, but IF there is a neurodiversity issue then one of the things I find really sad is that growing up in the late 50s/early 60s Manchester there would have been absolutely no awareness or understanding of neurodiverse kids who would have been labelled as strange or difficult. Fame, extraordinary talent and incredible youthful good looks allowed him a certain leeway with the press of the day up to a point until it all went sour. Now, being the age that he is, M is far too ingrained in his habitual coping/defense mechanisms to change and keeps entrenching himself further. The solution must lie in the way he is handled - you can't expect apples from an orange tree. It's just not his style to do a huge 'Mea Culpa' apology.

I think he is referring to a tweet sent by one time left-wing, now centrist, 'comedian' Mark Steel, who said "Now that Morrissey is discredited, it's a brilliant idea of Rick Astley to do his songs instead".

So effectively Mark Steel is reframing an act of fanboy love on Astley's part as an act of Astley sticking the boot in?

 

[Private Widdle]

What a wanker comment from Mr Steel. So Moz is 'discredited' because he has said some things he doesn't like? What a tosser.

Contrary to the widely held but lazy adage, it often seems that middle-class and lower middle-class faux socialists are the most unfriendly and mean people.
The back-slapping middle-aged 6music types might consider themselves left-field and, possibly, hip, whereas in reality they strike me as very unadventurous and very uncreative; sticking safely to their insular cliques in which they repeat their now-stale assertions that Johnny Marr is the "coolest guy on the planet”.
Meanwhile they believe mistakenly that their admiration for Rick Astley's Smiths versions comes with a knowing irony, when in fact they are oblivious to the reality that it is merely a signal of their steady amble further into mainstream-establishment-mouldy-nostalgia fandom.
*I have nothing against Johnny Marr.

 

[Amy]

I agree, it's very sad and frustrating - but is it true that he has pushed away Chrissie? Wasn't Johnny working with her a long time in the past, so is it not possible that she is friends with both like Noel Gallagher? With Sparks, was it not they who jumped ship? Clearly, M does 'banish' people for whatever reason, but I'm not sure that these people appearing at Glasto all no longer have relationships with him. What is clear is that M has an incredibly intransigent nature and no power on earth will shift it (surely part of his twisted appeal?) Therefore, he will probably never apologise. I also suspect, as others have previously mentioned, that there are some neurodiversity issues going on here - not to disparage him in any way (and my son is on the ADHD/ODD/Autism spectrum), but I genuinely think that he perceives the world and other people differently - which is part of his gift - and that his social interactions may be inept for a reason. Whatever is going on behind closed doors, I think the best we can hope for is a reappraisal of his achievements in the press, a cessation of the ill advised Central posts, a thoughtful interview with one of his peers (Nick Cave?), some great live shows, no more Steptoe trousers and a better haircut.

Oh, I hope Chrissie is still his friend for sure. She's great and has been a bridge between them many times and I really, really hope she still is. I love Chrissie. I can easily imagine though, if you're sitting watching Glasto at home and feeling a bit left out, then it might look like she's picked her 'team', so to speak. She's wonderful and a true friend to them both as Kirsty was.

 

[Amy]

Agree with your general stance, but I don't see Chrissie/Johnny currently being close as an issue.

As far as I can tell, CH and Noel are the two people who remain close to Moz and Johnny, and probably the only two who could bring about a rapprochment. It wouldn't surprise me if either now act as unofficial emissary. I'd have thought CH is the one person he'd take a talking to from.

Wouldn't be surprised if she shows up at one of the UK shows to introduce him, like Brixton about 10 years ago.

Oh, I absolutely agree. She's banged their heads together before and may do so yet again. And you know, things might be more positive than they seem, there may well have been some thawing after Andy's passing. It's just hard to see at this moment. I feel so sad for M to miss out on a chance to be on that stage, and frustrated with him at the same time. And even though it's unreasonable I would love just one of them to throw a rope in the ocean and just say something kind about him.

 

[NealCassidy]

Inclusivity…. For those deemed fit to be included

 

[Lujan369]

Morrissey is like that, no one tells him what to say or post. He is not hypocritical, he says what he thinks and what many think and do not say... He may be wrong, but he is not one to recognize mistakes, that would be very oxygenating for him. In that of not recognizing if he is wrong,
I think when he regrets saying something, he should say well, I was wrong. What happens is that there are people who want Morrissey to think like them and that is impossible. People change. Many of us get tired of the speeches of left and right, the world changes, not everything is on one side or the other, there are positive and negative parts on both sides. There is also a lot of hypocrisy, many say they don't discriminate against people because of their sexual choice, racial physical appearance, etc., but in reality they still think like discriminating beings.

In my opinion, Morrissey should not identify so much with his ego, which plays against him sometimes when he recognizes for himself the things he said, but does not manifest them so that people see that he knows how to take a step back. Morrissey. You must do an interview and you must allow them to ask you everything the journalist wants. And you must respond in your own way. That would revitalize your image.
A mistake was to have recognized Rick Astley and there the response received, the non-recognition ignoring him, was nonsense. Those broken faces don't deserve anyone to go to those concerts. There I am with Johnny he was more acertivo. Moz wanted to support them and see how they paid him. Ra and Blossom are disgusting!!!!!

 

[Frank Jobsworth]

People are reading way too much into musicians and bands doing what they're supposed to do and having fun while they are at it. Mark Steel is just having a laugh, Morrissey isn't ever going to do a Smiths set so he isn't really being discredited, though it's strange a tweet by a minor UK humorist touched a nerve if that's what it is.

 

[Les Tameside]

If you choose the path of the outsider, you have to come to terms with the fact that the consequences are very real: just several hundred thousand fans and a house in Hollywood.

But no thanks from Rick Astley—your most famous impersonator.

Asked age 21, I’m sure Morrissey would’ve chewed his own arm off for this level of ignominy.

 

[Marianne Faithfull]

it often seems that middle-class and lower middle-class faux socialists are the most unfriendly and mean people.

What a joke, it is true that when the tories stole all the wealth of the state to serve their own click, they are very friendly. Toris are the same everywhere !

 

[Gaylord Deepstar]

What a wanker comment from Mr Steel. So Moz is 'discredited' because he has said some things he doesn't like? What a tosser.

Moz is out of touch with his audience and out of touch with the Zeitgeist. His rightwing burps are embarrassing. His albums are gathering dust on some shelve. He is no longer relevant.

 

[gashonthenail]

Moz is out of touch with his audience and out of touch with the Zeitgeist. His rightwing burps are embarrassing. His albums are gathering dust on some shelve. He is no longer relevant.

By rights Just Stop Oil should have disrupted Glastonbury. All that pollution and waste. But that wouldn't have gone down too well with their zealot fanbase. And let's fact it - they couldn't have made things much worse after the 'highly credited' Guns N' Roses died on stage.
Moz's audience looked pretty healthy at the last show I attended.
Glastonbury is way too middle class and woke for Morrissey. Moz would have been about as welcome as Mizzy entering a bourgeois townhouse in poshest Hackney without permission. Roll on Mexico and South America. Leave the woke to their reiki and Greta the Doomsday Goblin!

 

[gashonthenail]

'...a guilty pleasure without the guilt'
Mr Astley it seems is the new low fat yoghurt...

Blossoms and Rick Astley at Glastonbury review – Smiths hits are the very opposite of miserable now

Covering the Smiths’ back catalogue in a secret Glasto set, Blossoms are admirably tight, while Astley banishes any sense of moral queasiness at listening to these beloved songs

www.theguardian.com

 

[TheSmiths_1985]

Whether you think he’s actually racist or not, it really is a sad state of affairs that the general perception/view of him is so negative. The court of public opinion has decided, and I don’t think they’ll be changing their minds anytime soon.
Shame.

 

[Surface]

'...a guilty pleasure without the guilt'
Mr Astley it seems is the new low fat yoghurt...

Blossoms and Rick Astley at Glastonbury review – Smiths hits are the very opposite of miserable now

Covering the Smiths’ back catalogue in a secret Glasto set, Blossoms are admirably tight, while Astley banishes any sense of moral queasiness at listening to these beloved songs

www.theguardian.com

Good review

 

[gordyboy9]

What a wanker comment from Mr Steel. So Moz is 'discredited' because he has said some things he doesn't like? What a tosser.

so called comedian mark steel,iv had funnier piles,ouch.

 

[Thewlis]

Good review

I wonder if Johnny Marr would agree.

 

[gordyboy9]

I really disagree with all this (same old) negativity. On this thread. I think this website is horrible. This thread has devolved into everything negativity and into all doom and gloom, so fast. When there was nothing to even be doom and gloom about. So Chrissie and Johnny played at a festival that Morrissey didn’t sing at. Big deal. It happens sometimes. Sparks attitude toward him was deplorable. So Rick Astley did the Smiths karaoke set and could have been more thoughtful about his appreciation for the original artist’s songs? More thoughtful about his appreciation to the original artist? Sure.

But festivals happen, and not everyone plays at them all the time, and not everyone wants to play at them all the time, but all this “Morrissey isn’t in tune with his audience, Morrissey is over” is such a f***ing bore, and it is always such a heavy drag on this site, all the time.

Glastonbury is definitely where you go if you want to shit in a bucket and hear the cruise singer interpretation of Morrissey imposter auditions.

Not all of us do. So everyone’s happy now, right?

totally agree scant,M is literally the devil these days and yet axl rose had racist and homophobic lyrics with guns n roses and nobody bats an eyelid and their set was a pile of dung on saturday night.

 

[Moz Fan]

'...a guilty pleasure without the guilt'
Mr Astley it seems is the new low fat yoghurt...

Blossoms and Rick Astley at Glastonbury review – Smiths hits are the very opposite of miserable now

Covering the Smiths’ back catalogue in a secret Glasto set, Blossoms are admirably tight, while Astley banishes any sense of moral queasiness at listening to these beloved songs

www.theguardian.com

The expression "moral queasiness" used in this context makes me queasy.
Since when crowds are moral?

The great psychologist Carl Gustav Jung once stated:

“A group experience takes place on a lower level of consciousness than the experience of an individual. This is due to the fact that, when many people gather together to share one common emotion, the total psyche emerging from the group is below the level of the individual psyche. If it is a very large group, the collective psyche will be more like the psyche of an animal, which is the reason why the ethical attitude of large organizations is always doubtful. The psychology of a large crowd inevitably sinks to the level of mob psychology. If, therefore, I have a so-called collective experience as a member of a group, it takes place on a lower level of consciousness than if I had the experience by myself alone.”​

― C.G. Jung, The Archetypes and the Collective Unconscious